Podcast awards: Are they worth it?

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[00:00:27] Hello and welcome to The Podcast Advice Show, your go-to place for the latest tips and takeaways. Whether you're a seasoned pro hitting a plateau or just starting your journey, The Podcast Advice Show talks to industry leaders who crack the code to podcasting success.

[00:00:46] I'm Damien St. John. He's Ant McGinley. We're both award-winning podcasters and together we share battle-tested insight to help power your show up the charts. You can find out more at getpodcastadvice.com. This episode is a Podcast Awards special entitled Podcast Awards, Are They Worth It and Why Do We Care?

[00:01:08] I love the way you introduced it at the beginning, battle-tested insights. And this, I think, is the first episode where there is an element of battle because if you're going for an award, you're competing against other people more directly than normally. So you've produced your podcast, you've promoted your podcast, and then awards come along and they offer you fame, fortune and glory.

[00:01:29] And all you've got to do is work out what a good write-up looks like and then edit the heck out of your podcast back catalogue for the last 12 months. It's a lot of work, isn't it? Yeah, it is. But I think the actual process is really useful because it forces you to do a couple of things. And the first thing I think that's really important is, is it makes you think about listening to it if you've never listened to the show before.

[00:01:52] And because you're going back sometimes a year, you're able to do that more critically. Because if you've done, if you listen to a show the day after you've produced it, you can still remember everything you did, everything you said, you're still emotionally attached to it. I think when you have that distance, you can listen to it more objectively, I think, really. And that's what the judges will be doing. I've got five questions for this week's episode, podcast awards special. Question one, why do people love winning awards?

[00:02:22] Well, first of all, it's a big tick on the ego monitor or whatever you have that checks that. And I think also is there's a belief that there's a validation in it as well, definitely. It's one of those things when your mum or dad or your partner or whoever goes, what are you doing all this time? You can go, look, look, I want a thing. So there's an element of validation.

[00:02:42] However, I think there's an expectation that you will, you know, also then you've cracked it and fame and fortune is just the other side, which isn't quite the case. We got an award, by the way. They'll probably bring that in at this point. Yeah, if you're watching on the video, it's worth checking out the video if you're not right now.

[00:03:00] This is our independent podcast awards for best sports podcast. And we'll get to the podcast awards that might be useful for you in the UK in 2025 in a little bit. Has this changed my life? So I'm going to give you an honest answer. Has it changed my life? No, but I'll tell you the moment when we did win the award, it suddenly felt like you were breathing quite rare oxygen.

[00:03:29] And that was not something I'd expected before, because I think I'd got into the habit of we won't win. I mean, we do a wrestling comedy podcast and I thought, well, it's OK, we are niche. We'll just keep going. And, you know, it's OK. You then start to talk yourself into the fact that it's OK to never win, but you're always convinced that you'll win at some point. Yeah, I think that was the classic example of awards don't matter until you win one. I think that it really did.

[00:03:53] But I remember feeling that great sense of satisfaction afterwards and to the point of you feel validated. You absolutely do. So I think that brings us nicely onto the question, where's the value in entering and or winning a podcast award? The really interesting thing, any podcast event you go to, I think, is really special because most of the time you're doing your podcast, it's just you.

[00:04:20] Now, there's going to be times when you've got it with a co-host, you've got a guest on, but a lot of the hard miles, the hard work you're doing on your own, you're in the shed, the back room, wherever you're doing the editing, you're doing the production, you're doing the marketing, all those things. And to actually spend time in a room with other people that understand. One of my favorite things about going to a podcast event is not having to explain to people what a podcast is or what I do. We touched on the value maybe being that validation that you get.

[00:04:50] I think there's a lot of self-doubt in podcasting for that very reason. So entering is you should pat yourself on the back if you've managed to find the time to do that extra work to enter. If you get nominated, a nomination, quite honestly, is as good as a win in terms of that validation. Just because you got to the mountain but you didn't get there first doesn't mean you didn't hit Everest and that wasn't awesome. Yeah.

[00:05:16] It's about recognizing the efforts that you've put in to get you this far. Yeah. Now somebody called me up on this before and said, what we got is not a nomination, we got a shortlist. So you nominate yourself and then there's a shortlist that comes out. And being on that shortlist is a massive thing. And again, if that happens to you, it's a great opportunity for you to market yourself.

[00:05:36] And also remember, even if you don't win, just pick up any film poster or DVD that you've got lying around and you'll see how many times it's been nominated for an Academy Award or a BAFTA, even if it didn't win. They know how to market things. Take a lesson. Take a leaf out of their book. Yeah. Do people still have DVDs or is it just you? Got one here. Why have you still got a DVD? Are you not using the internet to watch your movies anymore?

[00:06:04] I have trouble letting go of things. I take issue with the pedantry of shortlisted nomination. For me, I don't like shortlisted. It just implies that you're nearly there. Longlisted and shortlisted. We're carving it out because it ultimately is about the one winner. It isn't. It's about that pool of talent. You do not win an award unless you put yourself forward for it. You have to sort of take the time, create the entry, pay the fee sometimes to enter and put yourself forward and put it on.

[00:06:34] And I think it's a good practice for you in going through creating the award entry. It will help you recognize what's good, what's unique, what's special about your podcast. And you can then apply that to your own marketing. Okay. So where's the value? The value is in the validation of getting a nomination or a shortlist or whatever language you want to use. It's in being able to evaluate your back catalogue as a listener would do and not maybe in the bubble of producing it.

[00:07:02] Let's say you win because we've spent a bit of time going, you know, it's okay just to enter. And if you don't win, it's all fine. What if you do win? Where's the value in actually winning a trophy and an award in terms of the podcast industry and what it can do for your potential future audience? Well, I think the initial value comes depending on which award that you've won. There's many different ones out there. They offer many different things.

[00:07:27] At the Independent Podcast Awards where we won last year, they had an overall winner which went to It's a Continent. And as part of their prize, you know, those very famous advertising boards around Piccadilly Circus in London, the big screens that run all the time. Part of their prize was for a couple of days. They had their show artwork publicized and held on there, which is pretty amazing. I mean, I'm not even sure.

[00:07:52] You've probably got a better idea in your line of work how much that would cost to have that kind of campaign, even just for a day. You want the honest answer? Yeah. About 300 quid. Okay. But still, that's 300 quid you don't have. There's somebody else paying for it and sorting it out and doing all that stuff. So there is value in advertising and marketing. Yeah.

[00:08:13] When we won the IPA, so if we mention that, they teamed up with Apple and they put together like a group of all the nominees, all the finalists. Let's use the right wording. And profiled them to the entire industry effectively through this page. And we saw a massive bump in numbers. Yeah. Whether that leads to subscribers, I don't know. Yeah. But it does lead to greater exposure. So it is nice.

[00:08:42] You do go, oh, next couple hundred people. That's cool. There's an injection of energy as well into the project because no matter how long you've been doing it, having that big pat on the back is a real boost for you. And the same thing happens with a shortlist as well. You know, just getting that little message from someone who's seen you've been on that finalist list. Can you just say that again? Finalist list. Go on. Finalist list. There you go. Actually, I think there's a ton of value in winning.

[00:09:10] And the question I would ask you to ask yourself before you enter is what do you want to get out of podcasting? And that award or even that nomination can help amplify or speed up what you want to achieve. I'm going to talk around an example that I know of someone winning an award and then having a very clear goal to go off and be a podcast fiction writer.

[00:09:37] And winning an award has enabled them to have those conversations and potentially pick up paid work to do that. But for us as Podomedy, once we had that shiny laurel, I think the interest in our comedy network went up tenfold because it's seen as a badge of approval. You're marked as somebody that can go out and set a goal and get it. So I'd maybe think about that if you're like, is it going to bring me fame and fortune? Not on its own.

[00:10:05] You probably still have to set your goal before you enter and even before you started your podcast. And it's not too late to do that now. In a bit, we'll look at the awards that we think are worth your time considering to enter in 2025. First, we're going to take a break on the podcast advice show. We're back after this. We're back on the podcast advice show. Podcast awards. Are they worth it? And why do we care? We've done.

[00:10:34] Why do people love winning awards? What's the value in entering or winning? Question number three. How can indie creators justify the cost of entering the awards? We discussed in an earlier episode, Ant, that the majority of podcasters probably don't make a penny. And that the average return from podcasting per month is about 200 quid. So how can you... It's a gamble, really. It's like putting your money in a fruit machine, no? Yeah.

[00:11:02] I'm just going to say as well, I dare say there's going to be at least a couple of people listening to this that are thinking, wow, if I was making 200 quid a month, I'd be very, very happy. So that's across all four or five million podcasts that we're looking at. So how can you justify the cost for awards? I'm going to be completely, brutally honest right now. For some of the big ones, you can't. I mean, I can't. We can't. I don't think... You know, some ridiculous costs out there for some awards.

[00:11:31] One of the main ones that we know off the top of our head that are in that top sphere, there's the British Podcast Awards. So for my money, anything over 100 quid is in a bracket of expensive. I'm not saying not worth it shouldn't enter. I'm saying anything that costs somebody more than 100 quid to get the value that we've just discussed is expensive. So the British Podcast Awards, early bird entry of £210.

[00:11:59] And there's a discount if you're a freelancer. So if you literally do it in your office or whatever. And that's before you've bought your ticket to go to the event as well. It doesn't feel like it's built for independent, which is grassroots, the majority of podcasters. For those people to be able to access that level of person and that level of profile. But there are lots of other awards out there, which we'll get onto in a moment. And so the other ones, there's the New York Radio Festival Awards. Very prestigious.

[00:12:29] Very prestigious. Very prestigious. And they have a ton of categories. And actually, I think slightly easier to win because the price is so primitive. But I think similar costing. And you remember, this is price per category. So if you have a comedy podcast that is a great interview podcast as well, double price to enter. You don't get the opportunity to go, well, could I just tick another box? No, no. They want the same amount of money again. Your ticket will be still valid, which is great news.

[00:12:58] But you can see how it becomes really cost prohibitive. The other one is, I don't know much about the Webbys or... There's the Webbys. There's also the Ambies as well, which is almost like the podcast industry. There's a couple of different awards in America which came together. And they're trying to make it... So they actually have an academy. And they're trying to make it reflect what happens with the Oscars. So they're very much moving towards that being the Oscars of podcasts. Now, actually, that cost is comparable to the British Podcast Awards.

[00:13:28] But you also get a discount if you're a member of their organization as well. And what you'll find as well, within the small print, there'll be all these kinds of offers. There'll be grants available for people of various communities as well. And there'll be some will offer free entry as well. So with the expensive ones, I would say look at the value from your price in terms of being at the awards. And look beyond the free bar.

[00:13:58] If you think the person that you want a job from is going to be there or they're nominated, right? It might be worth it because you get a bit of face time with them. Again, if you're trying to break into the industry or they offer free training courses, a lot of companies that run these awards will try to offset or justify that cost with extra things. I think if you're not seeing those and you think this is a bit of a stretch, it's all right to not enter. And then also Damien mentioned about one of the other awards where you have to pay every category that you enter.

[00:14:28] One of the great things they did at the Independent Podcast Awards was they kept the price of entry low. But then if you wanted to enter another category, it was only another £5 per category. And again, these awards are run for profit a lot of the time. So make sure you are profiting from the time spent entering and being there. I can't reiterate that enough, right? This isn't a wholly charitable exercise. A lot of the shows now will make it more accessible.

[00:14:57] A good example is the Cheerful Earful podcast festival that Podomedy sponsored in 2024. They launched, and in fact it's open now till the 15th of March, the Golden Lobes. No legal case to argue there. And that is specifically comedy podcasts. And Giles Geer, who runs that and his team and everyone he's connected to, have done an incredible job of putting that together at short notice to open up with a flat fee

[00:15:25] to enter as many categories as you think are worth your time. Now, I advise you to enter this, especially if you're in that comedy field. Maybe if you're doing a true crime murder one, there's possibly not a category for you there. However, great top tip for awards for you. Damien mentioned earlier about Early Bird, and a lot of these awards will offer you a lower fee if you enter sooner. I would take that a step further.

[00:15:51] If you can get in when an award's brand new, like it's his first year of doing those awards, first or even second year, quite simply because not as many people will know about that award, less people will enter. Therefore, you've got a better chance of winning just by scope of the marketing. When you look at the larger awards, like those that we mentioned earlier, because they've been established, because they've been around for a long time, because their market machine's on point, they have so many people enter it,

[00:16:18] your chances, you've just got a lot more competition. It's like Squid Game. Yeah. So, if you're getting early, you're going up against maybe 10 people instead of 100 people. And we did mention it before, the Audio UK Production Awards, specifically for those... Yes, of which I've been a nominee. Congratulations. Did you win? I was a nominee. Nominay's good. Just as good. Just as good. Just as good. That is one worth looking at. I think more for industry professionals, but if that is on your kind of goal list, then definitely.

[00:16:49] What I hadn't thought until we started discussing this is that if your goal is networking and making a living out of it, is it okay just to buy a ticket to the awards? Yes. Like, if you think, well, I don't really fancy the two, 300 quid for the British Podcast Awards, but I would really like to hang out with some people and just get noticed and say, could I follow up with an email? Is it okay just to put the 100 pounds in and think, why have I got to roll the dice on a full entry?

[00:17:16] You get so much from even just the briefest of conversations with other podcasters out there, people working from a different perspective, people that have, just through these conversations, have made great connections for guests. I've learned about new tools and pieces of software, new techniques. I've been put onto podcasts I never heard of, which became firm favorites, and I still go back to and listen now. And just those connections as well. You also meet people with great skills, like voices as well, that you go,

[00:17:45] I'd love to have you and do some work with you and you go forward for that. So absolutely, I think it's worth getting in the room and being there. Pro tip on that, get the book of the night or get a list of nominees. And if you sit down in your chair with a pen, circle those that you might like to bump into. I think if you're there as a professional, people expect that. They've worked their way up in an industry and it's okay if somebody introduces himself cold and says,

[00:18:13] hi, I just want to say I love your work and I'd be interested in working with you one day and can I send you a link or a portfolio? The rule of thumb though, if you are going to do that, and I encourage you to just go up and spend 60 seconds with someone. Don't pin them to the wall. Don't bore them with your verbal CV. Don't blow smoke up their backside. Just say, hello, can I send you something? It's nice to meet you and then move on. Don't steal a lot of their time. Because also there are, sometimes there are egos in the room,

[00:18:42] but actually it's just generally good practice not to monopolize someone's time if you don't know them. The golden rule is if they are having a two-person conversation, don't get involved. Two-person conversation is private. If it's like three or more, chances are someone in that chat wants to get out and it might be the person you want to choose. But I think that's a group conversation and there'll be a natural break where you can circle and join in.

[00:19:08] But don't block your copybook if you don't know the person by diving in on a private combo. This is Damien's way of signaling. He doesn't have a very big social battery, so just stay away from me. I do in the right time. And definitely, I mean, why you want to come and talk to me, but you're very welcome and pick my brain. But generally that two-person conversation, if it's private, if it's deep, they might not want someone cold calling like a Jehovah's Witness. Just wait for a bigger group.

[00:19:36] Or if you don't stalk them around the room either. But chances are everyone will have a bit of alone time and a bit of downtime at the bar. And it's okay to say, hey, I'd love to work with you in the future. Can I send you something? Some of these awards won't actually have a room, by the way, as well. So there's another benefit when you're looking at them. There won't be a cost. Some of them will all be done online. One that I thought of on the back of that in terms of representing different communities, the Latin Podcast Awards. Felix has been running that for years. That's all done online.

[00:20:03] So you don't have to fork out for a hotel and travel to go to those kinds of places as well. But whatever your community, there will be in awards. There's the Sports Podcast Awards as well. So there will be a niche. Question for you. Podcast Awards. Is there, are there any red flags for you? So in terms of red flags, something that really winds me up, I think there's a lot of awards out there that you pay to enter and then they make you do the work so they can effectively capture the data of your audience.

[00:20:32] So what you have to do is you enter and for you to get that nomination, you have to get as many members of the public and your audience to vote for you. And when they go to vote, they register their details, register their vote and therefore give their data as well. Same as mine. Same as mine. And, but they, they mask it as, and you do see this in a lot of awards and this is my, I'm going to boil it down simply the audience choice awards, the listener vote awards.

[00:21:01] How many listeners have you got to your podcast? 234. You're going to be in the same category is help. I sexted my boss or off menu. Chances are you're going to be up against a show that's got infinitely more. And all they have to do is one social media post to say, oh, we'd love to win this award. And like, by the way, they're rich. They're rich podcasters that don't need the award in the same way that you do, but it helps.

[00:21:26] It still helps validate the, the ecosystem of podcasting because it's produced by someone who's paid to produce it. And that person has a job and it's their job to produce it and senior produce it and publish it. So for them, those awards mean something different. It helps their company grow and scale for you. It means all the things that we talked about at the beginning. You've been slogging away with literally no recognition and it's your first sign if you've done a brilliant job. But if you're entering a listener choice, it's a straight numbers game.

[00:21:55] It's a massive shootout and you've got to not be unrealistic about your chances of failing in that category. And it's going to put pressure on you to alter your content for a period of time as well, because you'll be putting in new messages in the content. Please go here. Please go and vote for this. Please. And that's using up what could be a call of call to action to your Patreon, to your live show. Instead, you're actually sending them to this award for somebody else. That's a great point.

[00:22:23] Would you rather spend your time budget on social media, driving engagement for your podcast or getting people to register for something that you've got a high chance of not winning? Now, the one exception to that is there are a couple of awards where they will have judges that will create a shortlist and then it goes to a public vote. Now, again, those with the biggest audience will win. But if you get through, you've only got 234, you're still shortlisted and that's still very, very valuable.

[00:22:52] And for God's sake, follow the rules. As a judge, I've had some really good entries. The rule has been it's got to be 15 minutes. The tape has come in at 15 minutes and four seconds. It's excluded for those four seconds. Who excluded it? You. The Mr. Mr. Discipline. Since when? You turned up for our Edinburgh gig last year, eight hours late because you had a puncture and you won't forgive four seconds.

[00:23:23] But that's different. Yeah, it is different. It is different. It's double standards. What if somebody just can't edit their bit and they think it's really important and you need to hear it? Wow. That is harsh. Killing hopes and dreams over four seconds. What actually happened with that person was that their original entry was 24 minutes for a 15 minute section. All right. That is taking the piss. That is. So the organizers went back to them and said, look, it's got to be 15 minutes.

[00:23:49] And their second entry came back at 15 minutes and four seconds. I was like, come on. You've been told you've had to explain to you. No. Yeah. I mean, four seconds is just an early fade, isn't it? You can do that. So, but still, I'm not having that. I'm not having Mr. Lateness knocking someone on the head for four seconds. People will look back and it's a shame for you to lose just by breaking a rule. So look at what it is. The other thing to be aware of is the timescale. So they'll say, publish between this date and this date. Make sure you fit the criteria.

[00:24:20] We're out of time. I would say my closing tips. Get these things in your calendar early. Don't say, I've got two weeks to enter. For Ant's very reason that it does take more capacity than you think it does to select your best bits. And chances are in that awards entry, you've got to kill your children. And the bit that entertains you and feels is the reason why you started the podcast in the first place might not be the reason why the judges pick you to win.

[00:24:48] That's it for the Podcast Advice Show. Thank you for listening. The episode on Podcast Awards. If you've got any feedback on that episode or any of the episodes you listened to before, please come and find us on social media. We're on Instagram at the Podcast Advice Show. There's video clips on the YouTube if you want to watch that. If you're listening to the full thing, you can see what we look like. Ant is currently wearing a t-shirt from our wrestling show and his room is surrounded by child's merchandise.

[00:25:19] Wait, wait, wait, wait. What is he doing? I just got, I got, what is he getting out now? Now, I know I can't afford my own place at the minute. And that may or may not be because I keep back on getting things like this. A Mario Kart remote control car is my son who's three would love it. Yes, you must bring it down immediately. We'll accept reviews. We'll accept feedback. We'll accept shares as well. If you think there's someone who you know in the podcast industry or your mate is thinking

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