Rosie and Jim

[00:00:00] Hello, Thots TV here. We just wanted to let you know that we have a live show coming up at the Phoenix Arts Centre in Soho on the 20th of May. It's called Thots TV Aged Like Milk and we will be deciding which beloved shows from your childhood still hold up and which ones maybe don't. If you think woke culture has gone too far, you probably don't remember the 2000s well enough. If you've never seen us live before, it's always a super fun night. It's a little different to listening to the podcast on your headphones because we're all together in the same room. And our listeners are the best, so why wouldn't you want to meet more of them?

[00:00:30] You can get your tickets at AEG. The link is in our bio, on our social media and in our show notes. And we would love to see you there in May. Enjoy the episode. This content contains podcasts. This adult contains content. Adult content be advised. Enjoy the episode.

[00:00:57] When you're being dumped to the canal, you're already dead. Are we all sitting comfortably?

[00:01:25] Not entirely, but close enough. I'm never entirely comfortable when we're recording. There always has to be some sort of element of discomfort. The amount me and Meg shift around while we're recording. So quietly. It's as quietly as we can, but you stay in the same position the whole time. It's actually impressive. For me, it's the biggest sign of my aging because when we first started doing this, what, I was 23? Yeah.

[00:01:51] And I did not have as much of an issue sitting on the floor for two hours at a time as I do now. Go back and listen. No, no, no. You complained so much. Number one, we were in your box room. Yes. Where there was nowhere to put my legs. Or air to breathe. Or air to breathe. Number two, I just didn't have to shift around as much. No one room is a vacuum. We need that to be noted that there is literally no air in your room. You just mold. Only Elsie can breathe in there somehow. No.

[00:02:22] She's adaptive. If it makes you feel better, I have never been able to sit. Like, since I was four. Oh, I don't like seeing cross-like. I've never liked seeing cross-like. Because, like, from a really, really young child, my legs would go numb. Yeah, me too. Yeah. I don't know if it's poor circulation or if it's just my veins. Tight skin. Or my veins are, like, really close to the surface. So then when I cross my legs, I compress them quite a lot. I don't know. Narrow veins. I don't know. I bleed a lot. So maybe that's... You bleed a lot. Well, you remember every time I've given blood and they're like,

[00:02:51] you're such a fast bleeder. Such a good girl. You bled so fast for my mate. Well, this is Thots TV. Hello. I'm sorry. It's just taken us a while. I'm Elsie. I'm Meg. I'm Laura. And Laura bleeds fast. Yeah. So just explain. I have... I literally... The only explanation is that when I give blood, which I can't anymore, it comes out real fast. Like, I have no idea why. Every medical professional I've asked about this, they're like,

[00:03:20] your blood pressure's fine. Because she can't give blood anymore because she's given too much. More than the legal amount that you're ever allowed to give. Always give 100%. No, if you have MS, you can't give blood in the UK. They don't want it. They won't take it. I mean, in the US, you still can. I don't know what's wrong with... They're just overly cautious. They're just there so that you can still give blood, but pay loads and loads of money for your medication. Yeah, it doesn't seem like a good trade-off. But you'd be doing good.

[00:03:51] Yeah, I'd love to do good here. Be a net positive for the world. I'd love to do good here, but they won't let me. She sits down and they're like, right, so you're going to be here for about an hour, and Laura just laughs in their face, like, five minutes. She's expressed so much blood. Yeah. Always happy to serve the community. Thank you. Yeah. How have your days been? My day's been all right. Good. Yeah, yeah. Not too bad. Laura keeps saying that I'm being mean, though. Laura keeps saying that I've been mean to her, and I would just like,

[00:04:20] before it comes up again in the episode, I'd just like to state my case now that it is categorically not true, especially if you've done something to earn it. I object to this use of editing to dog me in. Yeah. Something's happened while I've been at work, and these two are just at each other's throat. I've done nothing. No, we've had a lovely day together.

[00:04:49] Until ten minutes after you got home, it's you. Right, must be. I've turned it on you now. I'm sorry. I'll be nice, I promise. Yeah, if you would. Right, I've had a nice day. Thanks for asking. Oh, yeah. How's your day been? Yeah, it's fine. I just said that. All right. Sorry, one of us at any... You're the fucking host! One of us at any given time has to be angry. Must be seething. What the heck? Oh, what a mess. What's your day been? You were present.

[00:05:19] I feel like you know. It was, I mean, it's uniquely stressful having three laptops or kind of not doing what you want them to do all at the same time in a day. Laura has been... Well, for reasons I don't quite understand, for her work, she's needed three laptops. And then last night, so one of them comes from the uni, right? Yeah, one's Meg's. One's... We bought it. It's the labs. And then there is actually another laptop,

[00:05:48] but I don't have it. One of my colleagues has it. So there's actually four laptops involved. And then I've also got my Mac, and Meg has her personal Mac as well. Oh, yeah. So last night... And there's a phone. We had our iPhones. And like the telly and shit in this living room. And there was so much tech. Like, Laura said, there's more processing power in this room right now than they went to the moon with. By such an insane margin,

[00:06:16] because there's more processing power in your one phone. Yeah. I walked into the living room, and she was sat on the floor, surrounded by three laptops. And she like had her... She was wearing a hoodie, and she had her hood up. She looked like she was hacking. Yeah, she looked like she was in a BBC drama, and she was hacking. Or she was playing loud house music as well, just like swaying. All she did was like a can of monster or something. You came in, and you said, you look like your brother. She did look like her brother. But you do look like your brother. He's your brother. So...

[00:06:46] On account of you being related. Right, I gotta... I just got to apologise straight up. This doesn't usually happen to me. It usually happens to... It happens to everyone else. Don't worry. It's normal. It's very common. It happens all the time. It's right. You just got a bit excited. It's never happened to me. Right, what I was gonna say is...

[00:07:15] I am a low energy today. Usually I've got to sort of bring up the mood, because now I can't drink iced tea. Thank you. Laura was offering my iced tea. Sugar. No, because what I've done today is I've had a coffee and a Celsius energy drink, which is very high caffeine. And I'm actually a little scared at how tired I am, despite all that. I've had so much caffeine, I'm a little scared.

[00:07:45] I mean, I have done that as well. Me too. The caffeine scaries. I've never done that. That's never happened to me. I had, I think, in the space of a morning, like six shots of coffee, because I was hungover and I had Saturday school. I bought Laura a coffee the other week, and I had to go into the coffee shop and ask her a triple shot iced latte. And the woman looked at me like, are you sure? And I was like, it's not for me. It's not, just leave me alone. Triple.

[00:08:15] It means three. Do you know what triple is? Well, because a lot of people I'll say, because I used to say latte with an extra shot, and then they look at me and they go, you know, that's three, right? So I changed it to triple, because three is inherent to the word. Yeah. And then they still go three, right? And I'm like, yes, that's why I said triple. I know what I'm about, son. When I got up at four o'clock to start work at Gale's at half five, I would like pour a cup of filter coffee and then put an espresso in it. Jesus.

[00:08:44] Jesus Christ. I would still come home and nap. My dad said that when he was at uni, people used to brew coffee with energy drinks. You could also brew coffee in coffee. That is so low down and dirty. That is fucking vile. Just sleep. My goodness. Just sleep. I couldn't. I had to work. No, not you. Them. I say coat to get the essay done. Ketamine to bring yourself down to sleep. It was probably speed in that day.

[00:09:14] That is not medical advice, by the way. It's no super fucking isn't. It's megacle advice. Leave me alone. I did. I did. Like I had friends at Oxford who said the law students legitimately did that. And I was like, that's fucking insane. So even though I'm pushing through very hard to stay sat up here, I will say that I'm in a really, really good mood. I'm feeling very blissed out and happy. I'm like a happy tired. Her face does say otherwise. I'm fine.

[00:09:43] By all means I'll see. I'm fine. There's pain in your eyes. Flop over in exhaustion. Me and Meg will take her. No, you won't because this is Elsie. Yeah. So this is Rosie and Jim. Rosie. Rosie and Jim. Rosie and Jim. Rosie and Jim.

[00:10:13] Rosie and Jim. Rosie and Jim. Rosie and Jim. I don't know the words. I don't know the words. Just repeat it enough. They'll get the idea. So yeah, it's been requested a bunch. It's been requested a lot. And we are, you know, very ragdoll affiliated at least. We are not ragdoll affiliated. I don't mean with the company. I just mean like we really like them. That's not what I'm affiliated. Aligned. Yeah, we're aligned. Ragdoll pilled. Yes. Yeah, we're ragdoll pilled.

[00:10:42] It has been requested online a lot since the beginning of Thoughts TV. But I want you all to remember that when you fondly remember in a nostalgic way shows that you loved when you were five years old. You were five years old and we are 27.

[00:11:06] And we are the ones that then have to go, okay, and watch a couple of hours of footage made for preschoolers. And it's just different. Sometimes we do shows for really young kids and we're like, oh, this is actually so good. This is lovely. This is a very gentle show.

[00:11:31] I will say straight up, I think it might be too gentle for my now developed minds. It's also just like it's plodding in a way that almost nothing is now. Everything is so trying to keep your attention that this is so not even really trying. It's kind of refreshing or it would be if I could keep my attention on it. It doesn't give a fuck if you're watching or not. No, it doesn't care. Switch me off, I don't care. Hello, I'm John.

[00:11:58] You saw me steering the boat earlier on, but that's not my real work. My real work is writing books and they're books for children just like you. I'm making a new one just now. It's all about Rosie and Jim. They're my two ragdolls that I have on the boat. I like to pretend that they come to life. And I get ideas for the stories about them from the things I see as I travel on my boat. What shall I put in my story today?

[00:12:25] But this is the life we have chosen for ourselves and I'm grateful that we are the ones that get to do it. So thank you everyone for requesting this. Should we be trying so hard to make it sound like an honour? I don't want to alienate any of our listeners by saying we hate your suggestions because we don't. We really don't hate the suggestions. Like it was about time that we did it, you know. I quite liked it. Oh, I quite liked it as well. I quite liked it, yeah. It was fine. Yeah. That is often Laura's opinion. I don't know why she's here.

[00:12:57] It makes me mean to me this evening and I feel like I've done nothing to deserve it. She said, sorry, she yelled, you've been overstimulating me all day. And I was like, well, you could have said anything throughout the many hours of me doing that. I said that she'd been overstimulating me all day and then I admitted that I'd only decided that about 10 minutes before. I was like, you weren't overstimulating me until 10 minutes ago, but now you've been doing it all day.

[00:13:22] You know, I know it was two weeks ago, but you had this exact same conversation in our last recording session. Laura was like, Meg's been being mean to me. Sorry, I need to slap me in the face. I'm talking like a snail's pace. Jesus Christ. I would love to slap something right now. Yeah, I know. Oh my God. Pre-recording, Meg seems to just wind herself up at something. Usually me. Because I am here.

[00:13:53] She does. Why is she always so angry? Before you hear her call? Why is your persona angry? You're not actually this angry in real life. It's like a warm up. Like she's fine all day and then we get all the equipment. She's like, mommy. You're laughing because you know it's true, Meg. You don't know the reason why though, do you? I'm not laughing. Yeah, you are. It's not fun to pick someone out and just rinse them like you've just done to me. In front of everyone.

[00:14:23] Shut up. Listen, you can't see this. She's laughing. What's worse is I've had a chest infection so I can't even laugh silently because I sound like someone's grating something in my throat. It's like I'm having to turn away from the mic. Because you're crackling inside and out. I'm like, I don't know if it's going to pick up the noises that I'm making. They're horrible. Internal throat noises.

[00:15:02] We're moving, Rosie. Where are we going to, Jim? So Rosie and Jim, does anyone want to know things about Rosie and Jim? Sure. Maybe she should have had a nap before this. Maybe. So who wants to know things about Rosie and Jim? Yes, please. I'm hungry for info. Okay. Ever since I was a little girl. I've always knew I needed information. I've always been seeking answers to every question. That's you. Yeah.

[00:15:33] Did a study today that was literally one of the questions was, do you seek out knowledge? And I was like, strongly agree. Yes. I would strongly. And I assume if you're listening to this podcast, you. You also have a strong hunger for knowledge. Or you know us personally and you feel obligated. Hi. There's two options. Hello. Right. So. We've been naughty, Jim. Oh, naughty, naughty. Quick. Oh, quick. Let's go. What was that? Ragdoll Productions.

[00:16:03] Another one. We're back here again. What have we done? Yeah. Is this the third one? Well, we've done, obviously, Tots TV. Yeah. We've done In the Night Garden. We have done... What is it? What's... Describe it. Describe it to us. I can't. I can't. Is it Teletubbies? Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Teletubbies. The only reason I know is because on the Wikipedia page it's like related is Teletubbies and Brum. Yeah. They did Brum as well, but we've not done Brum.

[00:16:29] So it ran from 1990 to 2000. It was created by Anne Wood and Robin Stevens. So Robin Stevens is the voice of Tom from Tots TV and he's also the voice of Jim in Rosie. And Jim, I didn't know until today that he was part of the creation, but he was. He wasn't just a performer and puppeteer.

[00:16:56] He also was very much involved in the creation of the show. Fun fact, the person who introduced him to Anne Wood was Roland the Rat. Person? Yeah. Whoever performed Roland Rat. Oh, she's not in the mood for banter. No, no, no. Yeah. Yeah. The person behind Roland the Rat. I said what I said. So yeah, that's how they met.

[00:17:24] So this would have been before Tots TV. Hello. Is this their first thing, Rag Dog? It's not. It's not their first thing. They'd done a handful of projects before, but I think it was the first thing that was as big as this and people our age remember anyway. So they had a show called Storytime and it involved, there was a boat. I'm not, I've not seen it.

[00:17:52] I don't know if the boat was involved in the set or a storyline or something. I honestly don't know, but they had it. They just had it lying around. It's just a boat in the background of all the shots. Here's the boat. Don't worry about it. And there's a roundabout ahead, just like one on the road. And it's got water all around it. Here we go.

[00:18:19] Here we go round the roundabout, the roundabout, the roundabout. It was called The Rag Doll. The Good Boat Rag Doll is what it was. And Robin Stevens had the idea to turn it into a show. He was like, we could use that. So that's how the idea was born. I have a question. Yeah, you can ask it. Regarding houseboats, is it only the UK and the Netherlands that like engage in houseboat culture?

[00:18:49] In houseboat culture. I don't know. I guess anywhere with canals probably is... The thing is like China has a millennia old tradition of canals. And I don't think I've ever seen Chinese canal boats. I don't know. It's a good question. I think they're really cool. Do you think you could live on one? I get seasick. So no. So no. I like the idea. Do you get canal sick though? I don't know if I've ever been on a canal. I think that's such a cool idea.

[00:19:18] But I know someone who lives on a houseboat. And when I was doing my master's, we were all in class. And she got a call from presumably someone where she was moored. And it was like during a storm. And a branch, I think it was a branch or something, had fallen off a tree nearby and smashed one of her solar panels in half. And she was just like, I just need to go because my solar panel's in half right now.

[00:19:46] One of my colleagues in previous years, she was another TA. She lived not on a houseboat, not on like a canal houseboat, just like a different kind of boat that you can live on. And I would just be like, oh, how's that? And like the list of problems she would come back with, I'd be like, that's terrifying. She's like, yeah, I had to make this choice or I might have died of cold in the night. And I was like, that sounds not ideal. And like paying to be docked up in certain places, it seemed actually kind of expensive.

[00:20:14] You don't have an address, so it makes bank accounts and that kind of things difficult. So all the logistics wise sounds like a nightmare. Yeah, I would be very worried all the time. Like if I was with someone that knew how to operate a boat, I'd feel, yeah, I feel a lot safer. But I'm technologically not equipped to live on a boat because I'm not a boater. I think the stationary like barge houses in the Netherlands are so cool.

[00:20:44] They're so cool, but I'm pretty sure, and don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure that they started getting really popular because of the housing crisis in Amsterdam. And now they're really sought after and really, really, really, really, really expensive. That makes sense. Yeah. Tailor's old as time, innit? It's like, I don't think there's houseboats in Venice. Another canali place. You don't need to live on a boat when your house is already in the water.

[00:21:10] Yeah, I'm pretty sure you're right about the Amsterdam thing, but it's like now they're like, there's such a huge industry to make them because they're all like, a lot of them are so nice. You also don't in Venice, sorry, you don't really in like Amsterdam, you don't traverse the city on boats. Yeah. Whereas you do in Venice. Yeah, true. It's like, there's kind of more space on the canals for the boats. It's not traffic. Yeah, it's not a slow road there on the water. It's literally like a motorway. Yeah. It's literally like a motorway. It's not a motorway.

[00:21:40] Ambulances and cops come through in Venice on the water. Oh no, you're right. Yeah, you're right. It's the main road. It is the main road. There's no roads. It's all footpath and water. Although people do have like private docks, obviously, with the little boats tied up. And I did think that was really cute. Well, it's like the richer houses there, like the ones that are very old and like from noble families have just like a waterway in their basement. Like you just come in, park your boat in your basement. Like, it's really cool.

[00:22:08] So today I was listening to an interview on Jack's Throwback Attack, which great, great podcast is. It's the other British kids TV podcast. Fuck you, Jack. No, no, no. It was very, it was very useful. It was the main cast of Rosie and Jim talking about their time on it.

[00:22:30] As for actual facts, I couldn't sort of glean that much, like from a production perspective. It was mainly them reminiscing and just dropping names that I had absolutely no context for. So they were talking about like crew members and saying like, oh, I saw this person last week. And remember when this happened and this person was there.

[00:22:55] And it's like, okay, I'm not sure what's going on, but they sounded like they had the best time ever because they were working together for a decade. And the crew remained largely the same for the whole 10 years. So they were like, we were like a little floating family for 10 years just on the canal, which I thought was lovely. And it really sounded like they got along really well.

[00:23:23] And they were, they were talking like they've known each other forever. They were laughing. It isn't surprising because there's no room in those places. They would have been crammed in like with all the equipment, with all the cameras, the sound equipment. So, you know, those sofas you get on a house, but like very narrow sofas. The puppeteers would be in the side though.

[00:23:50] And they'd have their legs sticking out the bottom and the human presenter would have to step over their legs. And they were saying in that sofa, we just brought chocolates in there because we were so bored. We were just like snacking and they were laughing about how they were saying, oh, do you remember the sound guy would always say to us, like, you're chewing gum, aren't you? Stop chewing gum. We were so bad. We were always chewing gum and they could hear us.

[00:24:19] Jim, where's Tootle taking our boat? Where is he? To look for a song? It doesn't sound like a song. Rosie. Rosie. He hasn't made a song up yet. Ah. So on that episode was Robin Stevens, who is Tom.

[00:24:47] It was Rebecca Naggen, who plays Rosie. It was Neil, who was the third and final presenter. And he's still with us. The others died in 2017 and 2018. And the director, Nigel Harris. So there was a bunch of them on there. Hello. Was it the same director the whole time? No. Rob Ollerton directed. Douglas Wilcox directed.

[00:25:13] There was a few different directors and producers over the years as well. So it was produced by Anne Wood, Robin Stevens and Penny Lane also. Her name is Penny Lane. She's still producing kids TV, which I think is a sick ass name, but also kind of an unfortunate one. Bye bye. Hello. Hello. Is it there today? It is, yes. Thank you. It was Rebecca Naggen's first puppeteering gig. So she was just out of drama school in Birmingham, I think.

[00:25:43] Would make sense. Yes. Yeah, it's all in Birmingham. Yeah. And you see a lot of Birmingham signs and all of the like extra, not extras, but like the side characters all have very strong Birmingham accents, which is always a delight to hear. We saw our first ever Canal Roundabout. Yeah. Yes, we did. Canal Roundabout. It's like, what? Did, so did Rosie and Jim have separate puppeteers? Yes. Yes. It was Robin Stevens and Rebecca Naggen.

[00:26:10] And she said that in the first episode, she couldn't, I mean, she'd never been a puppeteer before. And crazy that she got fucking hired to do it. Rosie. It's just wobbling a puppet around, isn't it? Rosie wasn't even straight. Like they couldn't, she couldn't hold her straight. She didn't know how to do it. But now like she is, she's done so many things. Like she was in the hoops. She was in Bits and Bobs. We've done both of those things. She was in Spitting Image.

[00:26:39] She was in Becky and Barnaby Bear. Do you remember that? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Because like, I'm just thinking of like how they, they always begin on the little couch, right? And like, how is there room for two people there? Like that one. Don't ask me. I don't know. To me, it would make sense for that one to just be like, all right, I'm going to do one arm each. I mean, I don't know really anything about puppeteering. So. I don't even know what kind of puppets they are. I couldn't work out how they were moving. Like I'm guessing. I don't know. They were, their mouths don't move.

[00:27:10] They're very simple. They're very simple. I don't know if there was like sort of the arm rod things, but I didn't see those. So I have no idea. They seem quite heavy. Yeah. They look heavy. They look cumbersome. There's definitely a couple of times where I could see a human arm come in. Yes. Well, something they mentioned in the episode is Robin Stevens is infamous for just getting in shot by mistake all the time. We almost had him on, on the podcast, by the way. I don't know if people know that. We almost had him on the podcast. Yeah.

[00:27:39] No, we have told the story. We for sure have. He had to say, very kindly say no, because Ragdoll are very precious about their alumni being on non-children's stuff. Satirical. Yes, exactly. Yes. They take their branding very seriously. Absolutely fair enough. He didn't know what the podcast was and he'd already said yes. And we were like, we can't in all good faith have him on the podcast without him knowing what we do. Context. Yeah.

[00:28:09] Yeah. Because his son found us on Instagram and put us in touch and we were like, this is so nice, but I'm sorry. But he did say like me and my family laugh at your memes about Tots TV all the time, which was just so, so lovely. It's nice to be seen. It's nice to be seen and heard. Robin Stevens also was the voice of Duck, which I think I could have done. Duck's my favorite. I love Duck. I love Duck. I think I once posted just a compilation of Duck. You did. You did.

[00:28:39] You did. So funny. There's just something really funny about a quack. I found him really annoying. No. No. You're wrong. You're wrong. He's the funniest punctuation you could ever hope to have. That's fair. If every time I exclaimed at one of you two, someone just went, it would be great. We can make that happen. I'll do it. Imagine we're in the middle of a heated discussion and then when I've made a particular declaration, you just have to go. You would undercut the tension.

[00:29:07] Even funnier than the quacking is the noise of his little wings because he's entirely made out of words. So when he sort of flutters his wings, it's just so fucking noisy. He's a good alarm bell for the puppets to go back to being dead before the human comes in. God. Yeah. What do you think of the puppet? I personally find them quite creepy looking. I got used to it, but I quite like them.

[00:29:35] I was mixed on them because I was like, when I first saw them, I didn't particularly like them. I think the completely stationary face kind of is kind of jarring compared to some of the other stuff we've done. But over time, you're just like, yeah, they're fine. I prefer them to Tots TV. You prefer the puppets to Tots TV. Oh, I disagree. I think the Tots TV puppets are really cute. I think they're really weird looking. Oh, right. Okay. I prefer the little. No, fair enough.

[00:30:04] The little hippie couple. They are. Yeah. They are like all bohemian. I do. They are entirely made out of felt and live on a longboat. That's dangerous. That is literally the most hippie thing you could be. That is true. Yeah. That's. It's like one of those adverts where it's like everyone's made of felt. It's like. Oh, the Lenore. Yeah. Is it comfort? It might be comfort. What are those? Yeah, I don't know, actually. The horrible, creepy ones. Yeah. You'd feel with a spade if you saw one of those in your garden. Oh, my God. Hammers. They'd fit right in with those.

[00:30:35] Yeah, they are horrible, aren't they? Rosie and Jim went up the hill and took the duck up with them. And my bag. And my book. And all the beds. And John's books. And all the food. And the fridge. And the kitchen sink. And everything floated up with them. So let's talk about the presenters. So for the first couple of seasons, it was John Cunliffe. So I loved him as a presenter.

[00:31:05] I think he might be my favourite of the three. Me and Meg were just giggling because, well, for different reasons. But I was giggling because throughout the whole time watching John Cunliffe, me and Meg were just continuously pretending to be Elsie's dad. Because he sounds so much like Elsie's dad. Right. He doesn't. I'm not doing an image of Elsie's dad on the podcast. You have done a million times. No, I think he, I thought he was really cute.

[00:31:33] But we watched a video where someone had like compiled all the times he's putting his little gilet on. And it's actually a lot. Like, he's actually. I think it's a life jacket. It, it could be. It could also be a little gilet. It could be a little gilet. He drowns in a canal, Elsie. When you're being dumped in a canal, you're already dead. No, he just, it just takes him along. So there's a lot of an episode that's him putting a jacket on or taking a jacket off. It's very funny.

[00:32:02] And once you've noticed it, you can't unnotice it. He doesn't sound like my dad, but he has got a northern accent. Like your dad. Here, Elsie. Here, Elsie. Put your jacket on, Elsie. Here, Elsie. Have you heard this? Sorry, Elsie. I knew she'd do it. I knew she'd do it. But we were doing that the whole time. You were just baiting me into doing that. Yeah. He doesn't listen to the podcast. It's okay. You can mock him as much as you want. No, but your mum does. So? She doesn't care.

[00:32:32] She might relate it. She won't. Siobhan, this is between me and you. Okay? And several other people. Several? We get it. Hundreds of them. We do numbers, mate. You can see now that the water's much higher here than it is in the place where the boat is, in the lock. But if I open the tap using this key, then the water will run in and the boat will come up. So let's do it. I really liked John Cunliffe.

[00:33:02] What are you cute? I always struggle. I always struggle. I saw it and I initially read Cunliffe. Yes, I'm sure you did. Yeah. Which, but it's Cunliffe. Yeah. She's got lifts on the brain again. Wait, lifts? It was a joke because it was like, she's got cunts on the brain, but I... Very good. Very good. That's so silly. That's stupid. Oh, okay.

[00:33:29] The people at home think that you're just humoring me, but Laura is genuinely laughing. So John Cunliffe was the creator of... Listen, you'll like this. He was the creator of Postman Pat. Oh, really? He invented Postman Pat. Oh my God, is that why there's a Postman Pat book on view in one of the shots? Oh, I didn't notice. Must be. Yeah, I didn't. I don't know why I didn't point it out, but there's a shot of him drawing or coloring in or whatever.

[00:33:56] And the bookshelf behind him, the book facing forward is Postman Pat. Oh, there you go. Yeah. So he sold it to Ivor Wood. Oh. Longtime Thoughts TV favorite. It is a small circle, this lot of people. In it. It really is. Yeah. So actually, a lot of people think that Ivor Wood was the creator of Postman Pat because he popularized it with the TV show. But that's John Cunliffe. And he lived a very quiet, peaceful life.

[00:34:26] He was 85 when he died. And he lived in... I like to think he died on a boat. He did not. No. No. He... I believe he grew up in Cumbria. Like, he's... He did. He's from deep north. Kendall. Oh, there you go. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, he wasn't born there, but he, like, he grew up there. And then I think he worked in, like, libraries there. Yeah. He had a very... It sounds like a very peaceful life. Yeah. He had, like, a very gentle way about him.

[00:34:50] I really enjoyed his episodes because when he was interacting with the public, like, in episode one, they show you how locks work, which is very technical for the first episode of it, usually is just, like, what is this shape? Elsie was like, I want to watch this one because I need to know how locks work. And we were like... I just didn't know how they work. Well, because you first said keys. Yes. And we both assumed you meant keys. Yeah, but also... Not quays.

[00:35:18] We would have come to the same conclusion if she said locks. I'm all about my locks and keys, not the ones you think. Locks and keys. Yeah. So the episode one was called locks and I was like, I don't know how a lock works. I still don't really know how a lock works. Do you know how a key works? No. I did think when you said key, I was like, I think a key is pretty straightforward, to be honest with you.

[00:35:47] Well, I actually don't know how the internal mechanisms of keys work. I know what to do with one. Oh, you mean like a door key? Yeah. I was talking about, like, a boat key. Like a marina. Oh, yeah. It's just a car park, isn't it? For boats. It's just a car park. Unless that is a marina and a key is a different thing. Um, my experience with keys is there's two in Singapore, one called Clark key and one called boat key. And they're just bits on the river. Like they're just little collections. Prince's key. Shout out Prince's key.

[00:36:17] The dead car, not car park. Is it port? No, it's a shopping center on the keys in Hull. Yeah. There's another one in Hull, isn't there? Prospect center. No, St. Andrew's key. St. Stephen's. No, St. Andrew's key. There's another key. Oh. You twat. Another shopping center. Shout out St. Stephen's shopping center. I know, I know the names of the fucking shopping centers. And they, they weren't, there was nothing particularly boaty about them. Like there would be a little pier, but then it's just like shops. Maybe it just means like we've put shops near the water.

[00:36:47] That is not what it means. I'm fairly certain it isn't, but that's what it feels like. But maybe, maybe that's what it means. Stay curious. Yeah. We won't tell you because we're not going to pause to Google. Uh, I'll explain how keys work after, shall I? Okay, cheers. Cheers. Like, like the metal ones, not the boat ones. Yeah. Yeah. Please. Yeah. Anyway. Now, my canal book says that round this corner, there's a big hill and I've got to get my boat up that hill. How am I going to do that? Wait and see.

[00:37:17] You'll see when we come to it. In this pilot episode where Rebecca Nagan couldn't get her puppet to stand up straight, bless her, look at where she is now. Um, they explained how locks work and there's a, I thought, really beautiful, lovely, gentle scene where John- They go round the roundabout. Yeah. Oh God, they sing a lot. They sing so bloody much. Hello.

[00:37:45] It's a good way to lift a boat up, isn't it? Yes. Yes. I can feel it going up now. Yeah. Can you tell me how high each lock lifts the boat? About six metres. Six metres? That's a long way, isn't it? Oh, it is. And how many locks are there climbing up this hill? Eight. Eight locks? Yeah. So that means the boat is climbing up about as high as four houses. Oh yes, definitely. Goodness me. Yeah. And all with water. All with water, yeah. Wonderful.

[00:38:11] So John pulls up to the lock and he asks the lock worker to let him through and- The locksmith, if you will. Yeah. And they just have a really, I mean, very staged, very performative conversation. Like, nice weather today. Yeah, it is, isn't it? Can I come through? Yeah, come on then. Visibly overcast day. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Could you give me a hand?

[00:38:39] Yeah, I'd be really grateful if you could help me with this. And it's just two old northern guys speaking very slowly to each other. Yeah, they were speaking pretty slowly. It was just such adorable small talk. It was so lovely. And have you noticed also in shows of this time, I also noticed this in the supermarket episode where he's talking to the cashier, that they don't seem to be miked in the way that they would be now, right? Yeah. It's very muffled.

[00:39:09] It is like you are listening in on a conversation and it's not being performed for you. I watched a thing about this once because it's like the way of the boom has changed is what the video was called, I think, or something. Because how boom mics work now is very different. A lot of places don't even use them anymore because of some of those issues where it's like they now have like centralized hanging mics and people are miked and all these different. They've changed a lot of how people get miked up now.

[00:39:36] And then like a lot of older stuff, fully dubbed. Everything is dubbed. Nothing is... Well, it didn't even feel like it was ADI. No, oh no, 100%. Just bad. And so much kids TV stuff is like this. And I hadn't noticed until watching this. I was like, oh, this really has the feel of a 90s kids TV show about moving through the world and just sort of observing people doing it.

[00:40:04] I do also wonder if there was some issues with like how much water there is and mics. There was no issue with the cameras. That's fair. And also there was a scene in Sainsbury's where this was also going on. They could have... Indoors, they very much could have. At one point Laura was like, is there a parallel canal boat that they're filming from? Yeah. Did you find out the answer to that question? Nope. I do think like with these canals, there's always paths right next to them. So they might not have ever needed to. It was like traveling past the boat.

[00:40:34] No, that's true. I would have loved it if they're like, okay, we want to do this canal boat show. What we need is another canal boat. Like the outnumbered house. They had the house next door as well. Ah. And now I'm going to write in my book the story all about Rosie and Jim and what they would have got up to if they could have come to life today.

[00:40:55] One sunny day, Rosie and Jim were chugging along on the good boat rag doll. So that's John Cunliffe. Cunliffe. Do you know what it is? Cunliffe. It's because I keep wanting to say Sutcliffe. Ah, okay. Oh God. That's what it is. I keep wanting to say Sutcliffe. Cunliffe. Cunliffe. John Cunliffe. John Cunliffe. John Cunliffe. John Cunliffe. Right, we're moving on anyway.

[00:41:25] Oh, one more thing. They have nicknames. So Rosie and Jim have nicknames for each of the... They're requisite humans. Yeah, they're requisite humans. So Fizzgog was the nickname of the affectionate term for... John Sutcliffe. We're not going out there, are we? Well, Fizzgog says we are. Yes. See, that one I didn't pick up at all. The woman one, which we'll get to in a sec, hers was very prominently stated and felt

[00:41:53] a little mean, whereas his, I didn't hear them at any point or I didn't register them calling him that. It's also, I'm not being funny. I resent the word nickname when it's longer. It's like, that's not pseudonym. That's just a different name for him. It's not shorter, is it? Fizzgog, yeah, it's harder to say than... John, John. So Pat Hutchins is the second presenter. Rosie. Yeah? That's Pat. She's drawing.

[00:42:25] Jim, that's Pat. Loopy lobes. Loopy lobes, Rosie. Good. That's that picture finished. What I need is some good ideas for a picture on this page. So her nickname was Loopy lobes or looby lobes or something. Thrice the amount of syllables as Pat's. What is the point?

[00:42:54] I don't know. It felt rudder. Yeah, because she wore big earrings. Yeah, I do take issue with this. What did it add to the show? Nothing. Fuck all. I don't know. Teaching kids to call names. I don't agree with it. I just, I don't, I just don't agree with it, Els. I just don't agree with it. Ear, Els. They could have just called her Pat. I just think it's wrong. There we go. Well, I watch an episode where like, so I suppose this would be, well, a bad place to explain how the show works, but we've not done it yet.

[00:43:24] So let's do it now. Sure. Each presenter is looking for, they're trying to find something with each episode. So John is trying to find a story to tell because he's a children's author. Pat is trying to find a picture to draw because she's also a children's author.

[00:43:49] And Neil, the third presenter who presented the most episodes, he's trying to find a song to sing. He writes songs. Rosie, that's Neil. He sings songs. Jim, that's Neil. Toot toot. Toot toot. What shall I sing about today? So throughout each episode, you know, very, very gentle hijinks ensue.

[00:44:19] So in, there's a love of gentle hijinks. Sometimes it's not gentle. Sometimes it's annoying and chaotic. And you'd think that you were going crazy. Ah! What the? Oh, Jim! It's going by, by, by, by, quick. Oh no! Loopy! The room! We'll get on to the meta situation of how insane this show would make you feel. Yes. But.

[00:44:46] And as they go through their day. So, for example, there is an episode where Pat sees a baby drop its ball. She catches up with the mum, gives the ball back, and then she. Joins them in nursery. Joins them in nursery. It's so weird. It's like, look at these kids doing bath time. Please come in, stranger. It really is. It's so weird. Do you want to come have a look? Why? Oh, my God! It's like, does she not have a job to go to?

[00:45:15] No, because she's a children's author. Did you properly hook up your boat? I don't think so. Excuse me. You dropped the ball. Thank you very much. It was on the towpath. My name's Pat. By the way. Hello, I'm Debbie. Nice to meet you. Where are you going? It's a nursery centre. Would you like to come in and have a look? I'd really like that. Thanks. Throughout them doing their, you know, adventure, Rosie and Jim will observe them and learn things and sing songs about what's going on.

[00:45:43] And that is basically it. That's it. I'm getting the bath ready for baby. Oh, baby. What kind of baby? I'm not telling. No one tell me. No. Oh, is it a duck baby? No. No. Do you really want to know? Come here. What? It's baby Jim. Come on, Jim. Rosie, no. Stop it. No.

[00:46:11] Anyway, you're all dirty and you need a wash. Rosie. What? I don't want to be baby Jim. We're going to start with your hair. Oh, no. So the second presenter, Pat, she is also a real children's author. She wrote When the Wind Blows, which won a Kate Greenaway medal. She also wrote Titch, which was a Channel 5.

[00:46:41] Do you remember that? Yeah. Channel 5 stop motion show. So she's written a bunch. And Neil presented the most episodes. And there's a big difference, actually, in the Neil episodes and the earlier ones because Neil was younger and kind of... I'm not saying that the others weren't sort of game for anything, but the situations Neil

[00:47:08] was put in was a more sort of Matthew Corbett and Sooty situation where, like, he would be the butt of the jokes more. He would be the one in situations where he'd go roller skating down the street due to an adventure going wrong. Fell into some roller skates. He would have, like, pies in his face, like, that kind of thing, which the creators didn't really feel like they could do to John and Pat because they were not old and fragile. That's patronizing.

[00:47:38] But they were quite staid and sensible people. And they had a very calming effect on the show. Yeah. And it wasn't something that they wanted for those episodes. But when Neil came in, things got a little zanier. Oh, no! Oh, oh! Oh, the lady! There's that.

[00:48:07] Two kids TV Neils who were also both in rock bands. Wait, is Neil Brewer in a rock band? Yeah, it's called Druid. I don't know about now, but... Really? He was in Druids? Yeah. Okay. Is it becoming clear that this is one of my lesser prepared episodes? Mate, it was one of the only things on his Wikipedia page. Jesus Christ. That's bad, isn't it? Did you click through? I might have done. I don't remember. I can't remember.

[00:48:38] He's got a mullet. What, even now? No, well, in the show. I don't know about now. Well, mullets are coming back. I'm going to Google him right now. Okay. There was very, very, very little information about him. There was a lot more about the other two. Yes, because the other two, well, one created Postman Pat. Yes. He should be well documented. Yeah. So Neil said that years afterwards, I mean, still like today, kids come up to him and say

[00:49:06] to him, did you know that Rosie and Jim follow you around? No, never noticed. And they talk. And he says that he always says to the kids, no, they're just, they're just two ragdolls. What do you mean? No. And I think that's so cute. Oh, that's really sweet. Yeah. He also learned to play the concertina for this show. He plays it in, I think, nearly every episode. He's got a little box. Yeah. Like a beautiful box with Rosie and Jim on it.

[00:49:36] I love a concertina. They're such like cartoon instruments. It does make me think of like Lady and the Tramp. You look a little French when you play. I love that he walks around with a accordion and a, no, a harmonica. Huh. A harmonica in his mouth like it's a vape. And like, he like steps into the kitchen and he does a couple of notes on the harmonica like he's popping on a vape. It's so funny.

[00:50:05] Well, we must be grateful that vapes don't make noise. Imagine how noisy the streets would be if vapes sounded like mouthful. Yeah, like those musical electric toothbrushes. You're out in a club and the noise of the vapes is drowning out the DJ. Imagine how loud they have to be there. Everyone vaping in single. Just honking when you go into the smokers. Oh, the vapors are here. You might encourage smoking again.

[00:50:35] This one I can do subtly. Oh my God. I feel like it's poor information to share because I think it encourages the consumption of nicotine. But my supervisor was telling me about how nicotine helps prevent Parkinson's. So she's, she used to smoke like 30 years ago. And she was like, I don't, I didn't want to pick smoking back up again because it's bad. So I've started on the nicotine lozenges. Was that like a Zen? No, no. It's like a, like a soothers, but it's got nicotine in it. It's for helping people quit smoking. Right.

[00:51:04] Um, they're minty. And she was like, yeah, just to explain what I'm doing. It's a nicotine lozenge. And we were all like, hmm. Could just get a Zen. Well, so we talked about Zim. Don't do that. And then I, and she, cause she fully said, she was like, I would start vaping, but that would be more expensive. Yeah, probably. Yeah. She really worried about Parkinson's? I guess so. Should we be worried about Parkinson's? Maybe. Can you catch it? No. Oh. Oh. Oh. Oh.

[00:51:34] The nickname for Neil Brewer. Thank you. That they give him is Tootles. Tootles. That's cute. Yeah. It's also, it's still longer than Nick. But it was going to be before the producers put their foot down. Squeaky cheeks. It's funny. Why not? Why not? So it's hilarious. Tootles. Tootles, I think. So it's squeaky cheeks. Cause in my accent, that's just Tootles. Yeah.

[00:52:04] Tootles. Now, where's my harmonica? There it is. That's my harmonica. Do you know Booba? How well do you remember Booba? I remember Booba. Do you remember Grandpapa? Yeah. That was Robin Stevens. Was it? What a horrendous show. Yeah, it was awful.

[00:52:32] And they must have aged him up because he's not that old. He lives in the US now. He runs a cider business. Oh. Yeah, that's what he does now, Robin Stevens. John Cunliffe. He also wrote a play called The Twelve Days of Christmas, which premiered at... That's plagiarism, that. Plagiarizing who? Yeah, who wrote it, Laura? Who wrote it, Laura? Who wrote it? Fair point. It's all John Cunliffe's fault.

[00:53:01] Yeah, that premiered at Hull Truck. Hull Truck Theatre in 1996. Did it now? Yes, it did indeed. Hate that place. No, sorry. 1997. And no, you don't. In my head, I have such a toy version of whatever Hull Truck is because it definitely isn't a truck that goes around picking up theatre children. No. Any more, Laura. It was a truck. It was a truck. That's why it's called Hull Truck. Okay. Because in my head, it's like, you know, in Stardust, the witch, the ginger witch.

[00:53:30] Oh, what a great film. The little cabin thing she has that she's got a princess. I imagine that, but bigger for the Hull Theatre children. Hull urchins. The theatre urchins. It was from the streets of Hull Super Bowl. It was just costumes. All the costumes drove around in a truck. Why? Red knobs and broomsticks style. Why were they bringing the costumes around? Because it was a travelling theatre. It was a travelling theatre. Yeah.

[00:54:00] Hence the word truck. Okay, but like from how that was just presented to me. Does it not make more sense that it was a travelling theatre and they didn't just decide the word truck out of nowhere? Does that not make more sense? Do they only travel in Hull? I'll be honest with you. I do not know. Maybe Hull and the surrounding areas? Yeah. How old is it? Like, what's the... It was... Wasn't it John Godber who... He... Yes. He founded it, didn't he? Or he...

[00:54:29] I don't know if he did, but he is the one who... He was very involved in getting it from Park Street to where it is now. It used to be Park Street Theatre. And this is not at all interesting. I think it's interesting. I've been asking... For people who are listening. I have been asking questions else, as we said earlier. I am out for information always. True. Sometimes we ask questions and then we don't give anyone any answers to them. This is questions being answered, so there you go. Well, to the best of our knowledge. Yeah. You guys were in it.

[00:54:59] Speaking of theatre, Meg, do you remember Beautiful Thing? That play Beautiful Thing? About the gays on the council estate and their friend who thinks that she's Mama Cass. Did I see that? Yeah. Yeah. When was this? So, Andy Featham was our drama teacher at A-level. He was recently on local news because the guy that won the... Robert Arameo.

[00:55:29] Robert Arameo, who won the BAFTA for I Swear, went to... He was part of Hull Truck Youth Theatre, I do believe. And he went to our college. And he went to our college and Andy Featham taught him. And Andy Featham ran a... Can I just say, Rob, if you're listening, he went on about you all the time. Yes, he did. He banged on about you way before you were famous. Ten years ago, he was banging on about you, mate. He saw something in you. That's really sweet. I think it's because Robert Arameo is a bit older than us. About five years, yeah.

[00:55:59] Yeah, when we were doing our A-level, he was in Game of Thrones. That's right. Yes, yes, yes. And can I also say, Rob, if you're listening, that many, many, many years ago, your dad snogged my mum at a party. That is... What a mental claim to fame that is. It's a bit tenuous, but yeah. Hi, Rob, if you're listening. Nice to meet you. I don't think we'll ever meet in person. I did cry at his Oscar. Yeah. Back after? It was an Oscar, Laura. I'm sorry, Oscar.

[00:56:28] It was an Oscar. I'm so sorry. You won the Oscar. Oh, pardon me. Yes, pardon you. Anyway, Andy Featham, what were you saying? The beautiful thing... Beautiful thing that I am going somewhere with this. Do walk with me. I'm walking. I think I don't remember seeing this. At lunchtime, Andy Featham would screen in the theatre, National Theatre Live for us to watch. Oh, and I used to go because I was a nerd. Well, I think the drama students actually were required to go. Maybe we were. Yeah.

[00:56:59] That would make sense. I'm going to walk with that. I'll walk with that live. The beautiful thing was a play. It was scored, but it was soundtracked by music of the Mamas and Papas and Mama Cass Elliot. And it was set on a council estate. And honestly, nothing much happened in it. But it was a boy and his neighbour, two teenage boys, and they shared a bed at one point and they fell in love. This is where you have the gay pillow.

[00:57:27] That's why you have to have it. I really do think I'd remember this. I swear you saw it. Sounds like the kind of shit I'd remember. And they had a neighbour, this girl, same age, and she had like a psychotic break and started to think that she was Mama Cass. And that sort of never really got resolved. I don't remember. Let her live her life as Mama Cass. Anyway. Did she hate being called Mama Cass? Or am I making that up? Well, actual Mama Cass. I don't know. I don't know. Cass Elliot then.

[00:57:55] So it was based, this play was based on a Channel 4 film. Because of course, it was a Channel 4 film. It was about gay council estate children in the 90s. Because they do exist. They are there. And only Channel 4 will give them the time of day. And in this film, in the background, you can see Rosie and Jim being played in one scene. That whole tangent was leading somewhere.

[00:58:25] That's it. That's it. That's it. I would like you now to, on a scale of one to ten, rate the payoff. I'm sorry, everyone. Right. All that to say, I know this was requested. Yes. But there's just so very little to say about Rosie and Jim. I'd gobble it up right from the chimney to the front door. I'm going to draw that yummy house.

[00:58:55] Oh, OK. Yummy roof, yummy house, yummy window, yummy door. Hey, Jim. There's a nice juicy tree. I could eat that all up for my dinner. Oh, munchie, munchie tree. Yummy. I've got another fact for you. It's all I've got. The reason she's called Rosie.

[00:59:21] They always wanted her to be called Rosie because there is a type of design that you see a lot on those boats. And it's called Roses and Castles. That is the name of the design. So that's why she was going to be called Rosie. He was called Jim because it sounded good. That's it. Well, now we can speak about either the meta horror or the fact that they're a couple. They're definitely a couple. Oh, they're fucking. Yeah, they kiss in every episode. Yeah, beginning and end. Yeah. They're definitely freaks.

[00:59:50] Oh, yeah. They get some freaky shit. I did. I did say that I have to say this because people are so upset with us for Tots TV. It's all calling them a thruple. Yeah. But they're a couple. They are a couple. So I feel like I'm allowed to say that. And I think they're adults. That's Tots TV. They're children. You can't say that. They're puppets for one. Rosie and Jim. Adults. Adults. I think so. Yeah. I hope so. I, you know, possibly demons. We'll get to that. But, you know, definitely adults. Definitely like married, you know.

[01:00:20] Or just, you know. They don't believe in marriage. Common law marriage. Yeah, I'm telling you now. They don't believe in marriage. They don't. You know that they wouldn't send their kids to school. Oh. Can I say that? Home school. You're getting home schooled on this boat. You're getting boat schooled. You're getting boat schooled. Boat schooled. I've done a silly thing. I've completely run out of food on the rag doll. So if I don't find a shop today, there'll be nothing at all for my tea. Well, the book says that along here, there are lots of houses.

[01:00:50] And there's a bridge for trains to go over. And even a lot of trees. But they're not much good for food. So I'll have to just go and have a look. And yeah, because we watched a really funny YouTube video that was someone just bullying John and all his hijinks and Rosie and Jim a little bit. That was very funny because they just, in the way that kids shows the, tend to go is that sometimes the adults just sort of meander and bumble about in a way

[01:01:19] that is completely unrealistic to how normal people go about their day. No, John bumbles in a very realistic way. I mean like at the supermarket. Oh, let's talk about the supermarket episode. I think, I think we've reached a book now. Look at all the sweets and biscuits. Jim, they've got loads of food in here. They've got loads of, they've got sweets and biscuits. They've got loads. Jim, we've got to go and get a trolley. Jim, get a trolley.

[01:01:49] Jim, Jim. They've got loads. Insert real clip now so you can decide how accurate we were with that. Spice from biscuits. Me at the supermarket. You've got loads of biscuits. Oh my God. I was, I was at home last weekend and my dad reminded me of, cause I, I roast my mum and dad whenever I go home for just being so shit at doing a grocery shop.

[01:02:18] And I go home and there's 36 eggs in the, it's 36 eggs, some celery, some mayo. And that's about it. A brie. Yeah. A brie or some cheese strings or something. Some baby bells. And that's kind of it. When I was parents, I ate four different things. Every morning to help me get lunch. And I was, yeah, I was, I was, this is what I do.

[01:02:45] Like the, the last, you know, hour before I leave, I'm like, you can't be too mad with me for pointing that nothing's ever going to change. So now I'm going to roast you for it. It's like every time I go home, I buy a hot sauce just to have another condiment. And by the time I come back, it's gone, but it hasn't been replaced. So it's like, you want it, but you don't want it. And I was, yeah, I was like, you guys are just so shit at doing, doing a shopping order because mum is too chaotic and dad is too overwhelmed.

[01:03:13] And he was like, by the supermarket. How old is he? He reminded me that one time a few years ago, I accidentally had a shopping order delivered to their house instead of here. And I was like, and I bet it was the best shopping delivery you'd ever had. And he was like, yeah, it was actually, it was actually really nice. We had meals. It was full of treats. Because when you were living there during COVID. I did the shopping. You did the shopping. And the cooking. And the cooking.

[01:03:42] Because we FaceTimed a lot in COVID. And you, one time you were in the kitchen and you like, you'd be like, I've been making a few errors in the shopping. I think I'd been ordering things like the, like, frequently purchased, but not checking what we had. What do you have? Like eight boxes? It was three full unopened family boxes of Cheerios. And I pulled one out and I was like, oh, there's, and then I found another at the back of the cupboard.

[01:04:11] I was like, how much Cheerios have I been eating? Not enough. Clearly not. I was still buying them thinking that other people were eating them and no one was eating them. They were just like, yeah, no, fair enough. I'm also not great at the shopping sometimes. What happens when I order shopping here is that sometimes I'm like, oh, I'll check out now. I'll go back and do the amends later. And then it passes 11 o'clock at night and I've forgotten to do the amends.

[01:04:35] So I get the most random half, half-assed shop ever. Yeah. One time you'd left it and I think like maybe 10 things came. I was like, why didn't you? Okay. Just for context, the high street is like right there. It's a five minute walk. I don't want to carry 70 pounds worth of groceries. That's fair. That's fair. But 10 items. It was like chicken, coriander, some orange juice. A good meal.

[01:05:04] A good, a serviceable meal. Like some wraps. It was, I mean, yes, technically there was a meal there. You might be interested. We all actually do our own separate shopping. We do. We've lived together for six years and we still, I mean, we did. We do our own separate shopping except I order 35 cans of Coke and Laura drinks half of them. So I don't do the online shops and I tried to get a thing, like a big box of Coke off of Amazon. They're like, no, this is. You have to do with the Moritons. This is. We're Amazon. We can't deliver this.

[01:05:33] And I'll bill you eight quid for it. No, they'd be like, oh no, this is Amazon fresh. Unfortunately, you have to spend 20 pounds with Morisons to qualify. And it's like, can I not just get it from the normal Amazon section? No, it's Amazon fresh. So. So I'm without Coke and it is Laura's fault. Currently. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Apologies. No, you're actually with Coke because I bought you both some Coke today. Oh yeah. Thanks. You're welcome.

[01:06:05] Because if she doesn't do an online shop, Meg will carry on providing the Coke today. No, no, that's not why I prefer to go and pick my stuff there because I don't trust the pickers. Do you remember when we were at Union, we used to shop at Ocado? Yeah. What was wrong with us? I remember it used to be cheaper and then they like partnered with M&S and now it's like very expensive. Because they used to have some good stuff at Ocado. They used to have the most vegan stuff of like any of the shops and they probably still do because they have that like Italian Val Sawyer or whatever it's called.

[01:06:34] It's got really good stuff. But I, now I'm just like, that's to me, you have to spend a requisite amount of money on an online shop and I am perpetually broke. So I'm perpetually spending much less than you were on a shop. This is going to sound so middle class. And I was like 20 when I did this, but I ordered from Ocado. I think I only ever really ordered from Ocado when we had like a percent off or something. But I ordered, do you know what Cavaloneiro is? No. It's like a leafy green.

[01:07:03] It's like a leafy green. It's quite dark. And I ordered it in a like, um, when I was ordering like Pak Choi and stuff like that. And it was like a three for however much I ordered the Cavaloneiro. And I didn't realize how big, is anyone, anyone listening? If you know what Cavaloneiro is, it was like alien tentacles arrived. It was massive. It did not fit in the fridge. I had to like chop it in half to fit it in the fridge. It was absolutely massive.

[01:07:33] And I was like, what have you done? I never heard about this vegetable before I did this Ocado order. And now I've got this Cavaloneiro. And I was like, I actually don't really know what to do with this. This is the exact kind of shit that happens in Ocado. They've got like that, that like, oh, we, we have food options. And then you end up with Cavaloneiro and you're like, wait a minute. I don't, I don't have a recipe. What am I doing? Have you ever ordered it since? Or bought it? No, no, I don't even remember what I did with it, but probably surf ride it.

[01:08:02] So to talk about John in the supermarket. Yeah. So he is on his boat. He's got no food left. He is perfectly timed running out of all of his food. All of his food. And he says, I'm going to sail along the canal and see if I come across a shop. Like, no, John, you're an adult. You know where the shops are. And he's like, oh, there's a supermarket there. I'll go there. It's like, right. Okay. It's Sano's. Yeah, it's Sano's. And it's like old Sano's. It predates all of us Sano's.

[01:08:32] It's really lovely to look at an old supermarket. It's like 20p for a pound of apples. Oh my God. It was so upsetting to look at these prices. Yeah, the guy goes, please be ready to be angry with the prices. It's 99p for two dozen eggs. It's so upsetting. Yeah. Part of me wanted to see more of the prices just so I could rage even further. Because like, most... What could have been?

[01:09:00] The price of all the food is not the focus of the episode. But every time you see, oh, it's 49p for a kilo of apples, you just start like feeling such a simmering rage. My favorite thing about this episode is... So this is like a typical episode of Rosie and Jim where he's going on an adventure. In this case, it is the supermarket. And so at the end, obviously, you will see him telling a story about the supermarket because he is a children's author.

[01:09:28] And that is how they frame the episode. So Rosie and Jim are doing their thing where they are picking up items and getting up to mischief and picking up random items to go into the shopping trolley. So he gets to the end and he's like, oh, I don't remember putting this in. And the cashier who is like... The cashier. Cashier. What did I say? The cashier.

[01:09:58] Cashier. Did I say that? Yeah. The cashier. It sounds like a spice. What was I trying to say? The cashier. Yeah. What? It's because we've been talking about Ocado. Ocado. So she's so clearly a real cashier. Like that is so... A what? A cashier. Checkout lady. Yes. So. Sorry, checkout lady.

[01:10:28] A charcutte lady. My favourite part of this episode, it's so funny, is they knock over like Rosie and Jim while John's checking. I wonder what that noise is. Would you look after my stuff while I go and look? Quick Rosie! Get out of here! They're getting up to more mischief and they knock over like... A display of cornflakes.

[01:10:58] A display of cornflakes. There's a noise. And John says to the checkout lady, oh, what was that? Sorry, can you just look after my things while I go check? It's like, sorry, if you are, if you're paying for your things and you hear a loud noise in a shop. It's not your job. What you don't do is say, oh, do you mind if I just go have a look? No! You don't work here. John to aisle three. Oh my god, do you guys remember in supermarkets when I was a kid, the pneumatic tubes? Yes. I fucking loved those.

[01:11:27] They put money in and they just like, shot up into the air. What? No. So, and every, so like, you know how checkouts are too back to back usually? Yeah. Yeah. So in between both of them, there would be a pneumatic tube that went somewhere. Somewhere in the building. Somewhere in the building. They'd put cash in it. They'd get these like little big pill shaped things. Little big pill shaped things. It's a very big pill, but it's kind of a little object, right?

[01:11:59] And they'd, I assume, reach a certain amount of cash in the cashier. And then they'd put the cash in and they'd put it in and they'd press a button and it would go. And it gets sucked away in the building. Yeah. I love pneumatic tubes. No one uses them. No one's ever said that before. I love pneumatic tubes. I do love pneumatic tubes. That is a brand new sentence. It is such an efficient way to get information and stuff around a building. I agree. Yeah. But you don't really need to. Is it more efficient than email? No, that's the problem. That's the problem. It's certainly more whimsical.

[01:12:28] You can't email cash. You can. You can email cash. Cash. Cash. Physical paper cash. Physical paper cash. Why are we saying it like that? I'm trying to emphasize the physical nature of the cash. Cash. Do you remember the machine, not machines, the like bowls with a dome over where you would put a cone and it would like spiral down into the hole? They had them at the McDonald's in Windsor and me and my brother would be captivated.

[01:12:58] I would donate so much more to charity. Me and my brother used to go to McDonald's in Windsor. Oh yes. Not often. Do Brighton all not have their own McDonald's? The closest McDonald's. I don't actually know where this is in Berkshire, but it was like the nicest location for a McDonald's I've ever seen. It was like under this massive willow tree next to this lovely pond. And it was just this McDonald's placed on the side of us, like a dual carriageway. And that was our closest McDonald's.

[01:13:27] I have no idea where that is, but I have such fond memories of the place outside. Brighton listeners, if you could locate this McDonald's for Laura, we'll take her so she can reminisce. Our nearest KFC was next door. Whoosh. Do you? The fuck is a whoosh? Soft play center. Oh. I thought it was a chain. Never mind. Do you think, I always love it when you go to like a supermarket and they still have the guide dog money boxes. Yeah. I haven't seen one of them in ages. But when you do,

[01:13:55] it's like that is such a relic. There's probably money in there. Oh yeah. You can't use anymore. Oh yeah. For sure. The old pound coins. Yeah. The new version of that is, would you like to round up? Oh fuck that. Never do it. No, never do it. Never do it. It's like, go give five pounds a month to the charity yourself because it gets tax off for the supermarket. Yeah. The more charitable donations they make, the less tax they have to pay. Don't round up. Yeah. Pay for your things and leave.

[01:14:25] Or don't pay for your things. And leave. I will not be guilt tripped. Yeah, no, it's just getting tax off for them because they just integrated the blind dog boxes into the checkout. And even so, I don't, every time I say skip, I hope no one's watching me. No, if someone's watching me and makes a face, I will explain why. I'll make a show of it. Hate those cunts. Yeah. Another. Oh no.

[01:15:00] Oh dear. My birthday cake fell in the water. It's going blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, episode. I really like is from the Neil era and it's the birthday cake one. Do you remember that? Yes. It's, it's so fun. It's so good. So one of my favorite things ever is when puppets are doing like cooking or craft.

[01:15:30] And firstly, they don't have prehensile fingers. Secondly, the puppeteers are completely blind. And thirdly, the materials they're using are messy. This is one of my favorite things when puppets are just making it. These are a few of my favorite things. In conjunction. Mix it, mix it, mix it, mix it all up. Make it nice.

[01:15:58] Decorate the birthday cake. Lots of lovely icing. So in this episode, there is a birthday party happening on a neighboring boat. And the cake, the cake is also a brand new sentence. People are saying things that had never been said before.

[01:16:25] And I don't think it's been a very long time since we've done an episode where Laura has laughed this much. The grandma blows out the candles on the cake. And to make the story work, she blows the cake into the water. Some long time grandma. She was very popular in her day. I don't think that's how you do it.

[01:16:56] It just flies into the water. And then it cuts back to the family. And they're not mic'd up, but they're all sadly looking into the water. They all look very sad. It's hard to tell whose birthday it was. They're all equally upset. you never know. But in the background, there's a mom holding a toddler. And the toddler is wailing. She is crying. So obviously, because of something else. But it just works for the scene so well. Like she is bawling.

[01:17:25] Because grandma blew a whole cake off the table. The last of a brand new sentence. It cuts to the water. And the candles are sadly floating on top. And it's bubbling. It's like, why is that cake breathing? It's just some sad candles. It's so ridiculous. It's so ridiculous. So Neil decides that he will bake a new cake for them. He doesn't know them. He just saw this happen.

[01:17:55] Yeah. He's not responsible. No, he's not. But he has a spare cake. He's got a spare cake. It's un-iced. So his adventure that day is he's going to ice the cake. But he is distracted by things. Well, he just like keeps looking for another item to use to make the icing. And just it takes him so long. Yeah. And in this time, Rosie and Jim roundly destroy this cake. There is powder and sugar. Marshmallows. Everywhere.

[01:18:24] Chocolate powder. The powder. It's gone. And then in the top, they stick, you know, little cardboard bits of themselves. The dark. Cardboard pictures of themselves. Bits of themselves. I don't know. And then Neil like puts it on this boat. He doesn't like give it to them.

[01:18:53] He puts it there and runs away. They're all still really upset. However long it's taken, the icing took me down. Yeah. No, it must have taken hours. Yeah. And then it comes back to the family and they're still sadly staring into the water. And then one of the little girls turns around, sees the cake, brings it over to the family and they're all happy. And no one goes, where did this cake come from? And who are these people? Who are these people? Who are these effigies on my cake? It's such an ugly cake. It is. It's disgusting. It's disgusting.

[01:19:21] Because it has entirely been iced and decorated by Rosie and Jim. Does Neil think he did that? With no input from Neil. He was looking through the cupboards for so long, comes back, cakes, iced and decorated. And it's like, was I looking through the cupboards for so long that I forgot I'd already done it? But like, this is a perfect time to talk about the meta horror of the toy story living situation. It really is because one of my core memories of this show is,

[01:19:50] Pat is the one that I remember the most actually. And what I love about the show is they are constantly, A, referring to her as loopy lobes and B, fucking up her life. Like this. Where are we going? Rosie.

[01:20:23] Rosie. I don't think loopy lobes knows where she's going. Jim, let's go and see. Alcohol content of this wine we've been drinking. Maybe. I just think this because she's an older lady. And so to me, what they're doing seems more cruel. But when they're like, when they're doing things. Men fine, women not okay. You gotta be nice to them.

[01:20:53] They're fragile. They'll cry. And we will. Yeah. So when they're like doing their things behind the backs of their humans, they are kind of like laughing about the fact that they're getting away with it. Like this, I don't think it's malicious. It obviously isn't framed to be malicious, but they're mischievous. They're like imps, you know? And when they're doing this to Pat,

[01:21:20] Pat is so gentle and so lovely and so unaware that it just looks like really cruel in a really funny way. And that is the only thing that I actually remembered from watching the show. I just remember thinking like, God, this is mean. They just hate this lady. Good. That's that picture finished. Roses. There's you.

[01:21:49] Oh yeah. And Jim, there's you. Because it's toy story rules. As soon as the humans sort of pay attention to them, they go back to being inanimate. But yeah, so they like, as the duck usually serves as a warning signal and they go back to their bench and somehow always perfectly clean again. I wonder how many versions of them they had because you'd have to break for such a long time recording when they got covered in icing sugar. Or just water. Or just water. anyway. They changed color when they were wet. Yeah. But just like, A,

[01:22:19] the baby episode with Pat, they're so clearly visible. Pat is so clearly sat next to them watching them play with children. But the cake one, there's so many moments where it's just like, if that happened to me, if I turned around and suddenly the butter and the icing sugar were out and then the cocoa went missing and all of these different things kept happening, I'd be like, Oh my fuck. I'm, I'm, I'm going insane. I'm, I'm so concerned. I'm really, really worried. I'm going insane. But they're always just, Oh, I guess I did it. And I'm like,

[01:22:49] how can, how can you live like that? I don't. I think the fact that it is such a slow paced, ponderous show makes this even wilder to watch. Now, like I know that we always say that our job here is to meet the show where it is and not to make fun of it because it's for kids and it is what it is. Sometimes not too sure where the show is. Exactly.

[01:23:18] Like you've got to suspend your disbelief for many things. And I think that it just makes sense that the humans don't know that the puppets can talk and walk and do things. But because this show is so slow and the people in it feel so real because they, they are like, they're playing themselves. They're not actors. They are there to present, to frame the show. And the,

[01:23:44] the people they come across are just real like citizens doing their real jobs. Real Birmingham citizens. Yeah. The, the fact that it is so grounded and so slow and peaceful makes these antics just feel so bizarre. Yeah. It's kind of like, if you've seen, if you've seen, uh, Tots TV, you know, the dog in Tots TV that like kind of caught, he kind of causes mischief, but not really like,

[01:24:12] it's more like they need something and there it is because the dog has provided it. And the Tots don't know that the dog is there. And he's just this kind of entity that the viewer can see, but they can't see. Funny for children. Funny for children. Rosie and Jim kind of play that role in the lives of humans, except what they're doing is insane. Yeah. Right. I need butter and I need icing sugar for the icing. And what else do I need? Gorgeous.

[01:24:43] Huh? Let's help. Let's help. Not just providing a helpful thing. Doing the whole thing. Fucking your life up. Causing huge hijinks and like tearing around a supermarket so everyone else can see them tearing out a supermarket. Making things out of the stuff at the supermarket. Like, they turned a loaf of bread into like a little house and then just put it in the basket. And John doesn't even really look at it when he's like loading the conveyor belt up. It goes through the cashier.

[01:25:12] And she goes, what's this? And he's like, oh, I've never seen that before. And it's like, number one, they've been playing around with the produce, like naughty kids, putting it in the basket. And you haven't even noticed when you've picked it up. I mean, you're kind of asking for it. No, you're not. You kind of deserve it at that point for just not asking any fucking questions.

[01:25:41] Do you not have questions about the own things going on in your house to your everyday life? Like this is every day for them where stuff just keeps happening. I'd be terrified. Like if you turned around and there was a, I was going to say perfectly iced cake, but it was really jankily ice. It was, it was shit. But if you turn around and you'd been looking for something in the cupboard and you turn around, it was done. And you go, oh, that's fine. Uh, oh no. If I turn around and a cup of tea had been made without my input, I wouldn't be like, oh, that's nice.

[01:26:11] I'd be freaked. It's like, should we be teaching kids not to question when things are weird? It's just so incongruous with the rest of the tone of the show. Yeah. Yeah. I think what it is. And I want to be clear. Like, I think that Tots TV is vastly superior to this show. I enjoy to watch Tots TV. I found this just, I, I'm afraid I was bored, but I do think it's lovely.

[01:26:40] I think it's a lovely show. It's, I think it has its moments. I think that the fact that a musician or children's author lives on a boat on a canal and has a very sort of sedate life. Yeah. I'm tired. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's just a nice, peaceful thing to watch. I think that it looks lovely.

[01:27:09] Like the boat just looks really nice. It's, it's a nice show. And I feel bad making fun of it, but it invites me to. I would say the thing with the boat as well as like, cause they have three different presenters and it's all operating in this sort of odd, realistic, clearly not realistic place that it's like,

[01:27:37] how has each person then acquired the boat is a question that it leads me to ask. Cause it's like, Oh yeah, I'm selling my boat. You have to keep everything the same, including these two puppets. They come with the boat. You have no choice in this matter. You cannot change anything about the boat, but you may have it. Please take this haunted boat off my hands. I'm getting out of the boat game. Cause I think it's haunted. You have to take it off my hands. I can't believe he's in Druid. Do you know them?

[01:28:07] I do. Okay. Shall we give our final thoughts? Shall I ask the question? Yeah. Do you think it's worth a rewatch or a watch for the first time? I mean, I personally do. Yeah. If you liked it as a kid, I think you're still going to like it now. It was weird actually watching this cause I didn't watch this as a kid, but I've clipped so much of it for Instagram that I didn't feel like I needed to watch any. Yeah. Like I've seen so much of this already, but I think it's, it's,

[01:28:37] it's not like I personally, I think I found it more engaging than Laura Nelsi did. I thought it was quite funny. I love the duck. Very funny. Probably would be a lot more boring without the duck. I do love the duck, but I think it's worth a rewatch. It's not the most engaging show ever, but it's way more worth a rewatch than like Dora the Explorer. Oh, that's fair. Yeah. Actually. Yeah. That's, that's super fair. It is way more worth a rewatch than Dora the Explorer. Your kid has a question about like locks or something. It might be a good thing to stick on. It's weird.

[01:29:06] Cause it's simultaneously very plodding and also very insane. Yeah. It's like, it is some of, some, some of it is just a bit mental. Yeah. What about you, Laura? I, yeah. It's sort of, as I just said the, like, if you, I think if you want to watch it with your kid, I think there's relative, like it would be, it would merit there. Thank you. But, um, I was, I was so bored. I was, there was, I found the, the YouTube video we watched that was bullying, um, John, very, very, very entertaining.

[01:29:36] I think if you're watching it with friends to make funny jokes with each other or make a drinking game or something like that, it could be very engaging. But if you're just like, I want to watch some kids TV, I wouldn't go for this one. I gained a greater appreciation for it after listening to the interview with the cast and director because it just seems like a real family atmosphere and they still like keep in contact today.

[01:30:04] And I thought that was really lovely. And they were very, very clearly having a really nice time doing it. And I think you do get that from watching it as well. Like you can't really make something like that in those circumstances without getting close. Yeah. So, and they did end emotionally. They did mention that they were like, we've been in some real tight spots together. So yeah, I think it's a lovely show. I think it's peaceful.

[01:30:34] I think it's, I'm glad it exists. It's, it's not my favorite ragdoll production from ragdoll productions, but yeah, it's, it's nice. It's nice. And I like it. It's not in the night garden. It's not in the night garden. Then they went down to Bromwich and town, riding on the motor. Now, so it has grown dark around us. Yeah. It's now, what is it? 8.30 in April.

[01:31:04] And it was, yes, it was sunny when we started and now I can't see your faces. We are so in the dark. So let's give the socials. I think Laura wants to go. No, I just, I would like to turn the light on. Yeah. Yeah. No, that would be nice. Right. You can find us on Twitter at thoughts underscore underscore TV. On Instagram at thoughts TV, the O is a zero and on TikTok at thoughts TV pod. And you can email us at thoughts TV, 2002 at gmail.com.

[01:31:34] We have a Patreon and we have a discord linked on all the socials. We have a live show. I assume that was at the front though. Yes, it was indeed. So if you come in, we can't wait to see you. Well, this has been fun. Yeah, it's been fun. I've woken up a little bit. It's not helping that it's now dark. Literally, it's going blue in here. The caffeine did nothing for me today. Right. Good night. Wah. Wah. Wah. Night.

[01:32:01] This podcast is part of Podomity, the UK's podcast comedy network.

[01:32:29] Why not laugh at what else we've got? Visit Podomity.com.