Time for...Empowerment (featuring Tigz Rice)

[00:00:00] This podcast was highly commended at the 2026 Golden Lobes Podcast Awards. Nice!

[00:00:30] Today's episode is...Tigz Rice! This week it's time for...Empowerment! First of all, Esther can you not look so glamorous when we're recording Limited Time Only please? Do I look really glamorous? Yes, and I am...I am appalled because I look like I've just walked in off the street. No you don't, you look gorgeous! You look like you're off to a film premiere. Aye! Yes! What is going on?

[00:00:58] I mean... Do you know, that is so...I do look absolutely stunning! Do I? I mean, the fact that you're this freaked out that you think I look beautiful. No! No, you always look beautiful. But you know what? You do constantly surprise me. We've just had an exchange, everybody. Not surprise me because you look attractive. But even when Esther looks disgruntled, she still looks really gorgeous.

[00:01:27] We've just had a moment with our technology and it went a bit wrong. And we took screenshots of what was going on on the screen. And my face looks...I don't know, Mr Potato Head. And Esther, even though she's looking flummoxed and confused in this screenshot, she still looks utterly gorgeous. Do you see what's happening to me today? I'll post them on Instagram. Do you remember...

[00:01:50] Did you watch Fleabag when that was on and there was the episode when it's her mother's funeral and she's just going... I just thought it was going on. It's amazing. I don't know, Stacey. Do you know what? I wonder... So the only thing that I've done different today is this shirt is a man's pink shirt that I bought as a cover-up for the beach last year. Yeah. Because I tend to wear a shirt on the beach over my swimsuit. And then I just thought today, I'm just going to put it on. It's very pale pink. And I thought, no, it's time only colours.

[00:02:20] And then I found a very old lip liner that is a nubbin. And I thought, oh, I haven't used that colour for years. And I put that on and that's the only thing that's different. Wow. It's obviously working. It's working. You want some some energy. I'll have what she's having. I don't know what's happening, Suze. Oh, God, I feel empowered, Suze. I feel empowered. People will be rushing to YouTube to watch this now. Yeah, look at that. It's like someone else. It's like Catherine Zeta-Jones.

[00:02:49] Oh, my God. Catherine Zeta-Jones. Hello. Major girl crush in the 90s on Catherine Zeta-Jones. Okay. Well, you're channeling her and I'm channeling the tortoise out of the electric advert. No, you're not. No, I am. No, you're not. You look beautiful as always. As always. Oh, well, you know, I'm embarrassed now. What? I can't work with it. I can't work in these conditions. Excuse me. Where's the boss?

[00:03:19] No, we are the boss. There's nobody else here. There's literally no one. Suze. It's just me and Glamour Puss over there. I feel, I mean, it's just a shirt. I can't see my face, but I'm very, I mean, I do genuinely feel very empowered. After you saying that, that's so lovely of you. Well, it wasn't intentional, even though our conversation today is about empowerment. Yeah? Because I've sort of disempowered myself. Do you have? Don't do that.

[00:03:46] Well, actually, sort of, but also I feel good that you feel good. So I feel a little bit of a boost, but you know, still feeling a bit, you know. You look beautiful. Lesser. You always look beautiful. Well, thank you. And I can't speak now. I'm too embarrassed because I'm talking to a business lady. A business lady? Do I look like a business lady? Yeah, you look like a, you look like you should be in Devil Wears Prada. Running a magazine. Oh my God, Suze.

[00:04:16] Running a magazine. Stop it! I'm going to have weird dreams about you. You mean you don't already? Well, obviously. It's a pretty short. I've never discussed them before. They're going to get weirder. Well, I suppose we should crack on with the chat. Probably, yeah. We haven't even said hello. No, hello. We've just come straight on and got into this. And it is today all about empowerment. So, it's quite good.

[00:04:42] So, I hope everybody out there is feeling empowered because Esther's looking great. So, that should rub off in a... Tail end of a cold. So, maybe that's, you know, you know when you've been ill and then you're being rough and then you have a shower and you feel transformed. Maybe that's got something to do with it. Coming out of the cocoon. Coming out of the putrid, sweaty, phlegmy cocoon.

[00:05:08] See, now what I'm doing is I'm downplaying the compliment that you gave me by saying negative words about myself. And I'm not going to do that because I do do that a lot. It's like when somebody went to a friend's party a couple of weekends ago and I wore the top that I wore with you to the podcast awards. Yes. And every time somebody says, oh, I really like that, I go £8 H&M in the sale. Why? Stop it!

[00:05:37] Like someone said, it looks expensive. It's not. It was £8 H&M in the sale. But I love it. And you have to sort of... We all do it, don't we? And I'm trying as I get older to just take the compliment and move on. But I didn't. I still went to, oh, well, actually, I'm a bit phlegmy and I'm a bit... Yes. There must be an explanation. Yes. And then it's an anomaly that I look like this. Yes. You know, there's a discount version of myself. Yes. Something weird's happening.

[00:06:07] It must be a fluke. Yes. Isn't that odd? And instead... Yes. Instead, what are you doing? We need to say, I'm just a fucking baddie. I mean, I'm very much of the sort of person who, as soon as someone would compliment me, I will compliment them right back, which I am aware is icky. It kind of... It downplays their compliment.

[00:06:35] And it also makes me sound completely insincere. Yes. Even if... Yeah. For example, at work on Friday, we all had to look a little bit smart. Someone said to me, oh, you look lovely, Susie. And I was like, oh, so do you. I love the dress. But I was thinking, I do like her dress. And I was admiring it before. But now I've just said it after she's complimented me. Yeah. It sounds fake. And actually, that's what I... And I'm exactly the same. And I've just done that back to you. But I do always think you look lovely. Is that I... But that is the... She's backpedaling now.

[00:07:05] But it's... But I... But I do genuinely, genuinely always think you look lovely. And you're always so colourful and... I mean, you're black today. I know, it's unusual. But it is funny. We can't just sit with it and hold it and go, thank you very much. Yes. We have to go, it was cheap. Or, you look amazing. Or... But what is that? Is that... Is it a female thing? Is it a British thing? Is it a...

[00:07:36] I don't know. Is it people of our generation thing? Why have we been taught that we cannot accept a compliment? Because somewhere inside that is ingrained. Because what you said about the £8 H&M sale, it's exactly like the sketch that we do, the mastermind sketch, where someone compliments this character. Yes. She says, oh, thank you. I've got it for £2.50 in Dorothy Perkins. I think it makes me look fat. Because we... And we have this off pat because we sort of...

[00:08:06] Yeah, we can't go, oh, thank you. Yeah, I love this. I love this top two. Yeah. It's uncomfortable for us to be complimented. I think it might be a British thing because I know my husband isn't very comfortable with compliments and would probably sort of throw it back. And I've been listening to a really interesting book and this woman lives in America and it seems to be a slightly different mindset of like, yeah, you do look great.

[00:08:36] There's something about not wanting to seem immodest and wanting to not think that you think you're better than you are maybe because in this country we do have a tendency to... Well, it happens across the press, doesn't it? You know, you build someone up and then you knock them down and you... And so it's almost... I haven't got too big for my boots. I haven't got too...

[00:09:02] I remember actually when I was about 11, I mean, this might be a bit dark, we might want to chop it out, but when I was about 11, I just got into workshop. Yeah. And I remember saying I prefer the left-hand side of my face to the right-hand side of my face to my mum. And my mum said, oh God, you're not going to turn into one of those people, are you? And I said, what do you mean? And she said, you're not going to become all vain now because you're going to be an actor.

[00:09:33] And I remember that felt so brutal because I was just growing up and observing and everybody's face is slightly asymmetric. And one side had a more defined cheekbone and one side was a little bit... And I remember being so sort of wounded by that and thinking, oh, I mustn't. But then, I mean, this is why it's a bit dark, but then the wound was deepened because then a couple of weeks later we had our accident and I got scarred on that side of my face. On the nice side.

[00:10:02] On the side that I said I liked. So that, obviously, internally you go, oh, mustn't appreciate stuff too much. Even though rationally as an adult, you know, that's not correct. But taking all that trauma away... It's really... It's really... It is... I mean, it is dark, but it's really interesting. And something like that... Something... That comment has stayed with you. Yeah. Even if you're not conscious of it,

[00:10:29] it stays there and affects how you see yourself and how you respond to other people responding to you. It's... It's... Yeah, it's so interesting. And I think that... And the empowerment aspect is... Well, it's kind of going back to talking about what Amy Aode was talking about. It's healing that inner wound. But that's part of empowerment, isn't it?

[00:10:56] And saying, I'm not going to listen to that anymore, actually. Because, one, your mum wouldn't have intended you to remember that comment. It was just a flippant thing, she said. And actually, it's something about people's perception of actors that we're show-offs. Mm-hmm. And I think that sticks with me in terms of my family sometimes. That we're too much... You're too much. Too much. But actually, we're just being ourselves.

[00:11:24] But, yes, it's going, I'm not going to listen to that anymore. But it's really hard because sometimes you're not... Well, often, you're not conscious you're listening to that voice, are you? No. And it's just there, isn't it? And like you say, going back to what Amy Aode said, it then just forms these belief systems inside us. And I do think it is a British thing where we go, must keep modest, mustn't look like I think I'm too grand

[00:11:52] because people will bitch about you. And I do think that is a slightly more British thing whereas if you're someone like America, people will champion themselves. I was listening to... Well, I don't know if you've heard the Snoop Dogg speech when he got... I think it's when he got his star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame or he got something. And he said, I want to thank all these people, but I'd like to thank me. I'd like to thank me for not quitting, for doing stuff every day, for turning up, for believing in myself, for being a good person,

[00:12:22] for working hard. And I think, yeah! Yeah! And I remember years ago saying to somebody, somebody was talking about the drama group that I ran and they went, that's, it's brilliant. And I went, oh yeah, I'm really lucky. And she went, no, you're not lucky. You worked hard to make it successful. Yes. And there's something about... And to take that kind of ownership of it and say, actually I'm proud of what I've done. Yes. And the whole thing about the gratitude thing, which is a big... Well, it's a movement in a way, the gratitude movement.

[00:12:51] The idea of having a gratitude journal, that kind of idea is very new. But having gratitude to yourself isn't spoken about that much. It's quite a lot of external things. That is so much part of not having a big ego. And big ego was a massive insult, wasn't it? Yeah. If you think back to our teenage years, someone having a big ego, it's like possibly the worst thing. Yeah.

[00:13:19] And if anyone had a hint of, you know, thinking they were better than anyone else, that's the thing. Bigger or better, more talented. It's so false, that idea. I mean, yes, of course, there are people who think they're amazing and will just stampede over anybody else. But that's not what we're talking about. We're just talking about believing in yourself and being grateful for your own abilities. And not because it's all of that stuff is about downplaying your,

[00:13:48] downplaying your gifts and your talents. Actually, I remember having a conversation with my son a few couple of years ago, and he was really good at something. And he said he wasn't. And I said, no, you are good at that. And you can say you're good at that. And he said, I don't want to be seen in a certain way. And I said, look, sweetheart, I can say I'm really good at English, but I'm not very good at maths. But I'm really good at English. You know what I mean? And that's fine. I'm not saying I'm amazing at everything or I'm, you know, it's recognising these are the things I'm actually really good at. And I'm not actually very good at those things.

[00:14:18] And that's fine. But I can tell you I'm good at this. I can tell you I'm good at this kind of thing. You've done it again, darling. A surefire self-help-yourself hit. Thank you, Sandra. With so many women's voices being silenced, it feels like the right time to publish a book about female empowerment. Sandra? Sorry, I dozed off. It'll be out front and centre in the three for two section at the works before we know it. Thank you. Just one little tweak and we're good to go.

[00:14:48] Tweak. The title, dear. Empowerment is within. It needs more, well, power. Oh. How about turn me on? Excuse me? Turn me up. What? Turn me over. Why? Turbo woman? It's not a comic. Stick a rocket up yourself. Have I died? More power, less problems. That's not grammatically correct. Power up, weight down. That's not in any way correct. Fire down below. Enough now. Oh, that's good. Please stop. And another. You're cooking on gas.

[00:15:18] Actually, that could work too. Gas equals power, etc. This is ridiculous. I deserve a publisher who understands the importance of my book. I understand the importance of everything I say and do. You should have a long, hard think about yourself and learn when to shut up. Ooh. Bit long. But I like it. I'm always so impressed by people who are scientists or mathematicians, architect, you know, something to do with something that I have no idea about.

[00:15:47] But we are told that what we do is not that important. Yeah. Well, we have. And it's not that valid. And it's partly because it's very difficult to make, it's difficult to say this is exactly what we do. Mm-hmm. And our skill is something that's just, it's in the ether. It's not. It's hard to pin down, isn't it? It's hard. Really hard.

[00:16:14] So it's really difficult to say, to feel like you're really good at it. Is it saying, I don't know, say you're an actor and you haven't won an Oscar or a BAFTA. There's an assumption, isn't it? Because those that were as a statistician, we just accept. Yes. That's their job. That's their job. Okay, so they're good at that. Whereas a creative, and you know, I have met people in over the years who I don't like their work and I do think it's crap.

[00:16:40] And, and, and in fact, I had a play on a few years ago and a lovely friend of mine came to see it. And, and he said, Oh, I would love to see it again. I wasn't sure what to expect, but next time I bring my husband and I said, why didn't you bring him? And he went, well, and I went, because you weren't sure it might be crap. And he, and he went, well, kind of. Yeah. And I said, I totally get that because I've had that. And you've almost got to convince people because it's just stuff that's coming out of you creatively, isn't it? And it could be utter shit.

[00:17:09] And yeah, it isn't quantifiable what, what a creative does. And it, and we all have different life experiences and we're pulled to different things. Like this podcast wouldn't be for everybody, but it might be for someone else. But I am proud of the work that we have done and that's it, isn't it? I'm proud of the work that we've put out there. And I know to my mind, this is a good podcast and it's not just noise going out into the ether, but not everybody's going to love it.

[00:17:37] And that's what we need to, that's what we need to remember, isn't it? That's what everybody who's doing anything creative needs to remember. Even if it's not for your work, you're not getting monetary reward for it. It is, it's empowering to use your creativity because it's in there and it needs to be, you need to express it. And actually, because I was thinking about what empowers me and it is things like it's doing what I enjoy doing and it's being around other people that enjoy doing what I'm doing.

[00:18:05] So for example, going to choir empowers me, making this podcast empowers me, being, you know, doing my job when I, if I'm in a, in a play or if I'm recording the archers, I mean, and everything about doing the archers, I empowers me because I walk in there and I'm surrounded by like-minded people who love doing the job as well. And it's just a wonderful, supportive environment. And then it's hugely fun and I'm doing, and I'm using my skill, whatever skill that is.

[00:18:33] No, don't, no, don't stop it. No, I'm going back to how do you quantify it, but, but all such positive things and exercise as well as empowering, but that's slightly different. Doing this is so empowering. And I hope that it's empowering for people listening to it and enjoying it as well. It's community as well, isn't it? Yes. Like you say, it's leaning into the stuff that you love and adore doing and just doing it and feeling like you are authentically you. That's it. And you belong.

[00:19:02] And even, and even like going back to how many compliments you pay at the top of the show. Um, I like putting this shirt on sale. I was like, Oh, I didn't normally wear that, but actually if I do it like this, I quite like that. That feels different. And then that feels, then I feel like a different version of myself. So going to new places or having new experiences and or seeing new sites. I love walking around cities. I can walk and walk and walk whenever

[00:19:29] I come to London. Um, like say if we're meeting our friends at the South Bank, I will walk from Marilabone, Marley bone, never quite an hour to say it down to the South Bank. And it's like an hour, but I'm taking in all the sights and sounds and I am stimulated and I feel empowered. Yes. Yes. Or sitting in front of the sea and looking out, we go down to Whitstable quite a lot because my dad's from there and it's just, it's in my DNA and I sit on the beach and I just look

[00:19:56] out and you can sometimes see Sheppie and sometimes in the distant sea France, but quite a lot of time you don't see anything. And the skyline that makes me feel empowered because it just reminds me that I'm a tiny little speck on this planet. So why can't I do all the things I want to do? Like don't worry so much. Yeah. And so I find that empowering as well. Yeah. I, I also think when

[00:20:21] I'm celebrating somebody else's achievements, I find that empowering. So for example, I know at the moment, I know someone who's in a play at the national, um, uh, Madeline Leslie, who plays my daughter in the arts. We did a live with her. We did and we have, we'll have to get her on sometime for the full show, but she's at the national just before that. I knew someone else at the national. And then after Maddie's finished, there's going to be another friend who's at the national.

[00:20:47] And I just absolutely love that. I know people who are in shows at the national because it makes me feel great. I feel so proud of them and thrilled. And I love going to see friends in shows. Just absolutely love it. But I also think this is amazing because I know them and I know that it's possible to, to, to be at the national. And I suppose that is about, I suppose that is, that is the thing about being within, if you're a part of a family that doesn't have any connection

[00:21:16] to what you want to do, it's quite difficult to put yourself, place yourself, see yourself. It's about representation, I suppose, in a way. You can be it, isn't it? Yes. Yeah. And this is not about, yeah, not about, it's not about gender or race in this instance. It is purely about proximity to. Yeah. And I love that. And I love it when someone we know wins an award or, I don't know, or it does, you know, or is anything, or someone I know has just run a marathon, ran the Edinburgh Marathon. It's amazing.

[00:21:42] And she's fantastic. And Nadia Kramer, I'm talking about you, but I find that empowering because I'm like, yes, well done. And I know her and that's so cool. Yes. It gives you an, it gives you like an inner self-belief, doesn't it? But you're happy for them. It's sort of, it's inspiring. And what they say, don't they, that you are the sum of the five people you spend the most time with. So when your friends are achieving and succeeding or, or happy or doing the things they want to be doing, it doesn't always have

[00:22:12] to be big things, but it does, it does help. I mean, I don't know if you've ever had this, but I've had days where I have physically felt taller and bigger. Do you ever have that? I remember being, I don't know, a couple of months ago, my husband and I went somewhere and I went, I walked to the, I walked to the toilet and I'd got a coat on that I really liked that I bought at Christmas and I got a pair of boots on. And as I walked, normally

[00:22:40] I'm like, I'm not a grownup, I'm not a grownup. And in that moment, I felt like a W-O-M-A-N and I was probably like the oldest woman in the place, but I felt like a badass woman. And I sort of walked and I physically felt that I was about six foot. I felt really tall in my body and just really confident and strong and like, I know shit. I'm pushing 50. I know some shit. I don't know. It was just a feeling. And I felt really sort of, not in an hour again,

[00:23:10] I have to caveat, caveat, caveat, but not in an hour again. I just felt pleasant. Well, it was a feeling and it is something that's emanating from you. Yeah. And that, that is, and that is magnetic. So people were probably looking at you. I mean, I find it interesting how many people I think are taller than they are, who I know, for example, you, I always think you're taller than you are. Yes. Because that's because I perceive you as, I don't think you have to be tall to be powerful, but you know what I'm saying? No, but.

[00:23:36] It's a presence that's physically, physically bigger than you are. Yeah, no, I know what you mean. My husband's way taller than he is. Everyone goes, he's over six foot. And I go, no, he's not. He's 5'11". And he's not, he's not sort of an overbearing presence in any way. He's, he's a, but he, but he gives off a calm, confident presence and, and it, you perceive him as taller. Yeah. It's really interesting. Yes, it is. It is interesting. It's interesting. That's interesting that you say you think I'm,

[00:24:05] because I'm 5'6", were you? 5'7". Well, I'm 5'7". I know, I know you're only one inch shorter than me. Music empowers me as well. And when I challenge myself to do things I wouldn't normally do, so like starting this, starting other projects, writing a play, staging it, being absolutely terrified, pushing through that, getting to the other side and going, I worked that out. It just almost feels like you've climbed up another rung up the ladder.

[00:24:33] Yeah. I think a life without risk taking would be incredibly disempowering. Yeah. Everybody has an opportunity to take a little bit of risk and to try something different or try something differently. But I, I totally agree because it, I think that kind of goes back to what you're saying about going somewhere new and I don't know, even rearranging your room. Yes. Or rearranging a room and seeing it from a different perspective.

[00:24:59] Which I think actually is why we all, we should all probably go and be somewhere else or live somewhere entirely different or spend a day with somebody who isn't, is no way near the same as you, you know? And I think it would be empowering. And I wish we could kind of all arrange that. I love meeting new people. I really love meeting new people and having conversations and, and hearing different people's different angles.

[00:25:29] But I think it's because I think probably it really, it helped, it rewires your brain a bit because your, your, your neurons are not, and I say neurological, don't know it, I don't understand that. I know. But firing, your neurons firing in a different way and making connections differently. Yes. And it sort of probably in some way, rearrange yourselves. You could, your very being is being rearranged by this new experience and new, a new person, something different to think about,

[00:25:56] which is why we should all be going to see plays all the time and reading books because that, in its, in its very essence, reading is empowering. And that one knowledge, two different perspectives, three, just the pure act of doing it, because whatever you read, you're going to get a, you're going to get something from it. Yeah. I was doing some work up at performing arts school at the beginning of the year and they had a culture day, which was brilliant. And I might've mentioned it, so I won't go

[00:26:24] into it in much detail, but there was a woman that came in and did African drumming and I was drumming with the students and my God, I thought I had, I need to go away and do some of this because it was so somatic and the feeling of the whole room, it may be really emotional as most things do. But just, and then I went and did, um, uh, a class that was, um, Brazilian martial arts, but it's dance, capybara. Capoeira. Capoeira. I did some capoeira. We all ran around the room pretending.

[00:26:55] Capoeira. Um, it was so like, I didn't know anything about it and I, and I was getting involved and I thought, how do I go to one of these classes? I didn't even know this existed. And then he was giving us the backstory of where it came from and it was fascinating. And I thought, oh my God, there's so much I don't know. Yeah. Well, yes, that's it. That's it. And yeah, we, we should all be doing things together

[00:27:20] as a, as a group. It's so good for you, but, but creative things making music or art or theater or finding a drum, dancing. Or even going to see a sport that you'd never watch or like mountain climbing or something that you'd like to do. Yeah. It's something that's unifying because it, it does, um, it does bring us together. I mean, this is basically an advocate for the arts and sport. I think I totally agree.

[00:27:49] As long as it's all used for good. Yes. Because I think one thing I wrote was all the things that make me feel powerful are positive things. Shouting at my children does not make me feel powerful. It makes me feel awful and tiny and shitty. And, uh, so when I, you know, when you see people being awful to other people in the world at the moment, and I think to myself, does that make them feel powerful? I bet they think it does, but it doesn't. It totally diminishes them.

[00:28:19] It becomes a sad place as well. It diminishes them. You just wish you could turn everything on its head and go, look, actually get together in a big gang. Brilliant. That's so good. But just go and do something really nice. Go and do a litter pick or, you know, do some African drumming. Yeah. And you'll feel so much better about everything. And even if you don't like groups, you could go and buy a set of paints and try some painting or, or bird watch anything, anything sort of slightly leaning into what you enjoy or changing

[00:28:47] the scenery or something. I just think for me is empowering. Other people will probably, will obviously have very different experiences of what empowers them. I mean, sometimes it's simply like I've had a new haircut, you know, or something like that. And I feel like, oh yeah, feeling fierce. But it can be anything, can't it? But I do think anything that changes, pushes you, challenges you slightly, takes you in a slightly different direction can be frightening at first, but the empowerment comes from the having done it.

[00:29:17] Take the leap. Take the leap. Take the leap. Do some capybara. Yes. I'm really worried. Like really worried. So I went into Tesco's the other day and I bought a pack of pants, you know, like a packet of briefs and they were pastel and summery and dead nice. And I got them home and I opened them up and they were massive pants, like huge, massive granny pants.

[00:29:41] And I put them on and it was like stepping into a bit of heaven. They felt amazing. And I really liked what's happening to me. And I can't listen to radio one anymore. It's, it's too noisy. I like Radio 4. I actually like Radio 4. And I like Gardener's World and planting things and getting out into the garden. And I recently discovered Bruce Springsteen and Billy Joel and well,

[00:30:08] I think they're pretty damn amazing. And I've Googled it and it turns out I'm getting older. But do you know what's weird? I think I like her. I'm happy when people cancel plans and get into my PJs early and watch reruns of Kirstie and Phil. I'm happy that I'm old enough to be able to answer the questions on University Challenge from the clips that I see on Gogglebox. I'm happy that I'm learning

[00:30:35] how to say no and actually setting boundaries. And biggest of all, I think I know what I want from my life now. I'm starting to feel like a badass queen. Do you know what? I think we've been sold a lie. I don't think we do fall apart as we get older. I think we fall more into who we've always supposed to be. And now I think about her. I really like her. Did you get a replacement for your trophy

[00:31:04] at the end? No. Still chipped. Do you know what though? It's got a great story behind it. It shows that you were so happy about it that day. And also, you're not going to be too precious about it now, which means you'll actually enjoy owning it rather than it being that thing you don't touch on the shelf. So. Exactly. I've not seen it since, Tig's. I've run off with it. I've just come and did it. Today's guest is Tig's Rice, an empowerment photographer, speaker, educator and podcaster.

[00:31:32] Tig's spent her childhood aware that she felt different to other children. And it wasn't until she was an adult that she was diagnosed as neurodivergent. That experience of feeling unseen shaped everything, leading her into the world of burlesque and ultimately into a career helping others feel empowered and celebrated in front of the camera. She's published an award-winning coffee table book on burlesque photography, built a global following through her viral boudoir posing series,

[00:32:02] and in 2025, delivered a TEDx talk challenging society's definitions of beauty and body image. We talked to Tig's about her journey to becoming an empowerment photographer, burlesque, neurodiversity and what truly empowers her. Welcome to the show, Tig's Rice. I've been doing loads of research into you. I think you're absolutely fascinating and the work you do is

[00:32:29] so brilliant. What started this off for you? I'd like to go right back to the beginning because you talk a lot in your TED talk about the fact of feeling different growing up. I guess I spent a lot of time on my own and I loved being in my room, being creative, doing art projects, painting, drawing, taking photos. So I think I was kind of happy in my own

[00:32:54] self anyway. But yeah, I just, I always found it weird that at school, I just, I didn't have a group per se and I'd flit around and a lot of my friends always tended to be in the older year groups. And there was kind of a bunch of us that used to hang out together. We were the, the alternative kids. And I mean, when I say that, I mean like alternative fashion, emo, rock, you know, we wore our rose sweeper jeans and I had a neon pink fishnet that I'd cut like thumb holes in. I used to wear

[00:33:23] underneath my school uniform and dye my hair like flame orange. And I don't think I really cared what anyone else thought. I wasn't too worried about it. And yeah, but I think there's just been little things through life that I'm like, okay, I clearly think differently. I'm not necessarily part of a group. I haven't managed to keep any friends. I was kind of aware that, you know, what's this friendship

[00:33:48] group? What's this, what's this TV girl group that people have that like four way feral bestie chat situation that's going on. And, but then I also played a lot of sport and I was good at sport. So when it came to picking teams for things, I was the one that got picked first. I was like, you know what, like I've got, I've got this. So yeah, it wasn't, it wasn't necessarily exclusion. I maybe, I don't want this to come across in an arrogant way. I felt like my level of maturity

[00:34:16] was higher than what was in my year group. So a lot of my friends were minimum one year older than me per se, or looking back now, quite possibly also neurodivergent like I was and not knowing at the time. Yeah. It's interesting. And you're saying being bullied, but not, not letting that hold you back at that young age is, it's really impressive. I think.

[00:34:44] Well, I mean, don't get me wrong. I had a good cry. There were a few, I remember at least one day in year four where I got taken out of the classroom because I was upset and I couldn't tell you why, but I don't know. I just, I've never really understood why. I don't understand what people get from bullying other people. I don't understand having the negative thoughts and actively choosing to use your time and think it's a wise, a wise way to prioritize your time on this planet

[00:35:12] to say horrible things or write horrible things. So, I mean, I, I just don't get it. I don't see why someone would waste their time doing it. So therefore it didn't matter to me because it's like, I've got better things to do. Literally. That's so great. What age were you when you were diagnosed as being neurodivergent? Do you say what age? Yeah. What age? Oh, uh, 38. So literally last year. Oh no! Yeah, I really knew.

[00:35:39] But now that bit, I didn't know about you. So, um, so what was the process? How did that happen? And how did you feel when you were told? So I had never really questioned it and it wasn't until I had, had wrist surgery. It was around 2021, 2022. So, you know, that kind of COVID blip that no one really knows what year it was. Um, and so I had wrist surgery, whatever it was, it was the November and I'd, I have some hypermobility as well. So

[00:36:09] instead of it being, you know, I have the surgery, I had a double ganglion cyst. So I had one that grew out from here that went up. It was quite high. And then I had one that grew down and through the nerves, which was basically meaning I couldn't use my hand. And it took me quite a while to recover. And so I was having to rely on people to help me out. Uh, things like washing my hair or doing up my bra or carrying things. I had friends that were driving me to photo shoots so that the limited

[00:36:36] work I could do before my surgery, I could do. And the people who were around me were incredible, but even though just gently were saying, huh, it's interesting how your brain thinks, like, isn't it funny how you do things in this order? And it wasn't a judgmental thing. It was just like, huh, that here's a note. And I was like, Oh, cool. Like, well, how would you do it? And one of

[00:37:01] the things had been my husband was helping me, I think, get dressed. Um, and I was so set on, he couldn't help me finish getting dressed until I had put a cable away because I'm like, if I don't put that cable away, I will forget it. And that was more important to me than the task at hand, which someone else was prioritizing, helping me to do. And it was little things like that. And I remember just having a, a, just honest conversation with him. And I think it was the

[00:37:30] first COVID was the first time that I had been around people in day to day as a freelancer. And as someone who works in the creative industries, I'm seeing different people every day, mostly clients. So we're, you know, putting on a professional face, even if it is the authentic version of us, but the professional one. So they weren't necessarily seeing that I wasn't spending huge amounts of time with the same people every day. So they weren't seeing patterns. And then I'd

[00:37:55] come home and I mean, this is my studio. It's just me in here. It's a two by three box. I do all my editing and there's no daylight in here either. So I wasn't seeing people. And I think there were quite a lot of maybe traits that people just didn't see because they weren't spending enough time with me or, you know, I was coming home and getting on with my day. And so COVID was that, oh, like we're

[00:38:20] spending more time around people. Suddenly habits are being picked up on. And it was around that time that pretty much my entire circle around me of friends, all of them got diagnosed within two or three years. And I'm like, oh, isn't this interesting as a person who spends a lot of time. I, I've realized analyzing other humans, it's always been a special interest of mine, looking at people, watching people, looking at behaviors. And I just thought it was, you know, a fun interest,

[00:38:50] not a special interest. And maybe I would be a neurodivergent person actually learning how to mask. And that's what I was using it for. So everyone around me got diagnosed and I'm like, okay, what are your symptoms? And then they'd be telling me all this and that. I'm like, well, I do that. Not only I do that too. And I do that one. So yeah, decided to put myself forward for a diagnosis. And in the process of a few people had said to me, maybe you should put autism on that as well as

[00:39:20] ADHD. Yeah, whatever. Went into the doctors, they do a pre-assessment for you. And I filled in the question and she was nine out of 10 on that one as well. We'll put both through. So that would have been early last year. And then my ADHD one came through in August. It was not a surprise, but I did cry. But I felt more that it was validation. In the lead up to that time, I think,

[00:39:46] I mean, don't quote me on this, but there are, there are studies that basically say there is a link between female hormones or hormone levels and neurodivergence. And as you get older and closer to say perimenopause, menopause, it becomes more pronounced. And I feel like I was certainly maybe feeling that. So it had kind of built up and I was like, okay, well, is this something else? Or

[00:40:10] maybe is that, is it that? And it was kind of relief and validation of, I fought really hard to get this diagnosis and go through the appointments and all the paperwork and everything else that you have to do to jump through hoops to try and get a diagnosis these days. So it was honestly just, I felt valid. I felt seen. And then I started ADHD meds. I chose to go on them. And the first week

[00:40:36] I was on them, I realized that I had been living life on hard mode, not normal mode and everything changed. And honestly, it just, it just felt so different. I mean, don't get me wrong. The ADHD meds don't fix everything. But at the same time, life is just not a struggle. And I then went on a bit longer. The autism one, I have to say, they were so great. They told me it'll be five to six months. And if, if for anyone who's autistic to have a time length and go, okay, I'm in long wait mode.

[00:41:07] They literally came in at exactly like five months in a day or four months or like, you know what I mean? Like literally exactly just about when my brain started to think about it. And that one I was intrigued by, I guess I didn't have, I didn't have huge thoughts on that one. And in the most neurodivergent way, they said, you can, you go through, you fill in the paperwork, two days to fill

[00:41:33] them in. Was going through and it says, right, okay, which, um, autism, uh, autism assessor do you want? So you get to pick them. I literally went over to chat GPT and went, which one of these would be the best person to assess me? And it was like deep diving, researching the person who would be doing my assessment. And it said, this person would be best. However, I couldn't book an appointment with them. So I spent, okay, well, who's next. And as it was, I then got a phone call from them a

[00:42:02] couple of days later saying, funnily enough, actually the person that you wanted is the person that would like to see you. Can we bring you forward by two weeks? Could you do tomorrow? So the wait time was like four days in the end from when I filled in the paperwork. Um, you do the assessment. It was absolutely exhausting. Cried at the end of it just because I was so tired. Um, and then got the paperwork back and she was great. I literally did the test Thursday afternoon and I got my paperwork

[00:42:31] Monday lunchtime. Um, and at the time when I got it, I was like, oh, okay. Like, yeah, that I guess that's not really surprising. And then, then it hit me. So actually it was harder to process the autism one, I think, than it was the ADHD. And it took me a couple of months of kind of, okay, let me just step back, see how I feel about this. Um, I had a few people saying, oh my God, this is incredible. Can we feature you? We would love to talk about what it's like

[00:42:58] because a neurodivergent entrepreneur. And I'm like, I just need, I need time. I need to decide what I'm comfortable sharing, who I'm comfortable sharing that too, and what boundaries I'm setting around keeping myself safe rather than being advocate first. So it took me a couple of months, I would say. And then from, so that would have been early November. And then it probably mid to late Jan was when I was like, okay, I'm ready. Let's start talking about it. So yeah, a couple of, a couple of months. It's really, I've got a lot of neurodiversity in my family. I've

[00:43:28] never been diagnosed with anything, but everything you were saying there was ringing bells, um, even down to the asking chat to PD, which, which one you would use. Is that, is that a thing? Cause that is exactly what I would do. Which one's going to be the best and hyper-focusing? Anyway, it's not about me, um, but I have got it very close. Next episode. Autism and then ADHD is very closely linked to me, um, in my family. So anyway, we'll have a think about that. But I think

[00:43:55] also there is, um, I think, do you find, because in my head, autism is some, I've got an old version of autism, which I don't have anymore because I know lots of autistic people and, and talking to someone from the older generation in my family about somebody who I'm very closely related to having autism and their understanding of that and what that meant is quite a daunting thought.

[00:44:24] Whereas nowadays we know more about it, but actually it's not as extreme as we think it, you know, there's, there's in the Chris Packham documentary, he talks about the fact that if you've met one autistic person, you've met one autistic person that can be obviously very extreme cases where somebody might not be able to communicate. Um, and then the, there are like noise sensitivity and stuff like that. So do you think that's part of the grief that you experienced,

[00:44:48] which is the label of autism, um, or, or the sort of understanding who you are a bit more now and that kind of processing? Yeah. Um, do you know what? It definitely wasn't, it wasn't about the label or the stereotype. Um, I was, I, that itself was absolutely fine. Um, as it's called autism spectrum for that reason, it is a full spectrum. So, you know,

[00:45:18] it didn't, the title didn't bother me or like having a label or however you want to put it. I think it was just the, it was the reprocessing. I described it as if your brain was a computer and you have your RAM or your memory, if you're techie geeky person. Um, and that is the amount of processing that computer has to allow you to do things. So if you're doing something that takes

[00:45:47] up a lot of processing power, like editing video or something like that, it's going to take up a lot of that power, right? For me processing my entire back history of my life, every single chapter of it through this new neurodivergent lens that took processing power for me. So even though it wasn't necessarily my day to day conscious thought, it was still always running in the background. So I could

[00:46:14] be doing something and go, huh, isn't it funny how now that I know this, I can make more accessibility for myself, or I can ask for my needs or, you know, Oh, how strange this happened to me when I was a kid, that memories come up. Now that I know this about myself, I can look at that with more compassion. Say, so it didn't come from a place of anger and it didn't come from, you know, nothing along those lines. I was fully accepting of that answer. It was just more, Oh, that's so

[00:46:44] interesting. But also let me just go through every single memory and experience I can remember from my entire life, look at it through this new lens. And maybe it was taking up 25, 30% of what my brain was capable of doing that day, regardless of whether it was my active thought or my passive thought. So yeah, there was no, there were no feelings about having a label. And I think I'm also very lucky to,

[00:47:12] as a late diagnosed person, being able to see that there are so many more advocates and allies out there doing the work to make it a safer place to exist. Because the only person until maybe, I'm going to say five years ago, because I don't think even maybe 10 years ago, we had this, but the only autistic person I'd ever come across was a boy in my school. He was in my class at school.

[00:47:38] And he was a high support needs autistic person. And he was great. He used to walk around school. And he used to talk about his army that he had and everyone like people had roles. He called me one of his generals. And at the time, I took that as Oh, he ranks me quite high in his army, whatever. And I'm like, well, clearly, he trusts me. And I was like, it was just an honour. And I

[00:48:05] took that as a sign of, you know, okay, fine. Like he accepts me. I actually think he was possibly the first person to ever suss me out and go, you're one of you're one of us. And actually, that was a really comforting thought to look back on that moment. And I do have just really positive memories of interactions with him. And I'm like, hey, he was nailing it. So yeah, yeah, it's lovely that you

[00:48:30] talk about that, looking back at things and feeling that compassion for yourself, it all ties in to your kind of role on the planet as someone who empowers, who feels empowered and who empowers other people, particularly women. And it feels like that the diagnosis was part of has been I mean, I know it's very recent. But do you feel that that empowered you? In a way?

[00:48:59] Yeah, I feel like, you know, there's that saying of become the person that little you would be proud of. I think I have grown up becoming the person that I needed when I was a kid, the person that you felt safe around the person that made space for you and was inclusive. And, you know, in terms of maybe the friendships and not necessarily always feeling like I was people's first choice to hang out with. I wanted to create a safe space. But maybe I didn't have the language or the understanding

[00:49:27] of myself at the time to really understand why it's been so important to me to create these spaces for others. And getting this diagnosis has given me the language to say, you know what, this is why it's because it's based on my experiences growing up and wanting to make sure that absolutely everyone always feels included, that everyone is welcome. And it's okay to ask to be included as well as to be

[00:49:54] invited. So yeah, I think it all ties together. I just maybe didn't realise that that was the full why until last year. It's brilliant. It's kind of the final little, little, you know, piece in a puzzle. I'd like to talk a little bit about your, your TED talk, and then we can kind of go around there because I'm, I thought it was just brilliant and inspiring. We will have a link to it on the show notes and everybody should watch, um, Tiggs's TED talk. And it brought, honestly brought, it was tears to my

[00:50:23] eyes and a fire to my belly. I was like, yeah. And I've been talking to my daughter who is 11, who is already critiquing her body. It kind of makes me upset to be honest, because it's so hard to talk to her and reassure her. 11 years old. I mean, I look back at myself and, and I think probably I was lucky in that I've, I think, I think I remember the first time I really had a negative thought about my body, which was when I was 17. So I kind of got through quite a lot of

[00:50:53] life. I know I did really well. Um, but she's 11 and it started when she was 10 and I said, I'm going to show you something later. I'm going to play her the, your TED talk. Um, and I really hope it gets through to her because what you say about everybody is a beautiful body and everyone deserves to take up space and beauty standards are, well, they're, they're cracked. They're

[00:51:20] completely, well, it's madness actually complete madness. Um, because everybody is unique. Um, so yeah, I just have to start from there. Really? My daughter was one thing, but it's kind of why you're doing it. I suppose it's for, you know, girls and women who feel like that. Yeah. Body standards are the most ridiculous thing because as I said, in the TED talk,

[00:51:48] most of us genetically cannot be whatever the current standard is. And we have these wild trends where suddenly everything has gone back to heroin chic again. It is about like skinny is the new in, you know, Monjaro is being, I don't have that many adverts online. I can't stand adverts in TV shows,

[00:52:12] but I was around a frenzy of the day and every single advert on whatever platform we were watching on was a weight loss jab. Should be allowed. Why is it allowed? I just find it so interesting how we absolutely swing one way to the other and there's no in between. It's either the full Kardashian curve and we're celebrating body positivity. Although I have issues with that term because I don't think

[00:52:42] it's actually that positive anyway. Um, and then we swing wildly the other way and it's like, you know, in some conversations, we cannot talk about looking after our bodies. Um, people don't like hearing us talk about how we're looking after ourselves. We don't talk about diets. We don't talk about this, but at the same time, we also expect you to be supermodel skinny and wearing clothes with single digits and as close to zero as possible, which is so arbitrary anyway. And then at the same time,

[00:53:11] then you can't talk about wellness and looking after yourself and we just wildly swinging each way. And if you constantly are chasing that, it is impossible. It is impossible. And also don't we find it really interesting that at a time when we're oppressing women and taking away women's rights, sorry to get political on this, but we're taking away around the world, we are stripping women of their rights. We are bringing in rules about abortion, about pregnancy, um, around the world,

[00:53:39] everyone's having their own separate, vitally important issues about around women's rights. And at the same time, we're also now telling women they have to be really skinny and taking away their strength and power that we've just spent 10 years telling them you need to step up. Strong is the new skinny curves are in and funny how we're oppressing women and also I'm demanding that they shrink themselves at the same time. Yeah. It's, it's, it's incredibly political, isn't it? The whole,

[00:54:07] the whole thing it's all part of, um, well, it's oppression. Um, and what I don't understand sometimes is the perpetuation of this through magazines potentially, and that are actually female led that sometimes I think there is a lot of beauty standards. It's perpetuated by other women,

[00:54:33] but I suppose, I don't know if we've been programmed to think like that. We are conditioned to it. It, it, it seats through. It's the thing that your friend said, it's the thing your mum said, you know, shout out to all mums. They're all trying the best. Everyone's on this planet for the first time, but we're taking bits from different generations, passing that down. We've got our own security insecurities that are coming onto us. We also live in an age of being chronically online. I know I'm

[00:54:59] guilty of that one. And so this information seeps through to us and, you know, yes, there are things that we could all change in our own tone of voice and how we speak to others. But here at the end of the day, we also, a lot of media is controlled by ad spend. And so where is the big ad spend coming? Well, it's from the companies that are bringing us down. There are companies out there

[00:55:26] that's entire advertising budget is spent making us feel insecure about our bodies. You have a problem. We'll help you fix it. Spend some money to fix it. You know you have that problem. Yeah. It's, it's, it's capital, capitalism. I was talking the other day actually that was showing, um, but that was about, um, companies and they were saying when a young girl or a young male looks enough at something online, it was,

[00:55:51] it was literally saying right now, sniper them with this fat loss jab or sniper them with this, when you feel that they are at their weakest, then going with the advert. And that level of, well, it's just, it's, it's awful, isn't it? To think that there's that level of terrible marketing going on where we're trying to literally knock people down to then go in and sell them something. I mean, it's, it's sort of even going back to the news and things like that. It's,

[00:56:21] we're constantly being sold. I mean, I know there's a lot going on, but the news is very different to how it used to be. And so we are all living in this state of fear and self-protection and must fit in and must, and it's, um, it's constant. It was a barrage of noise constantly, isn't it? Yeah. But I mean, even if you take this down to an absolute cellular level, I mean, all three of us run businesses. I'm sure there are many people that are listening to this who also fit into that

[00:56:51] category. I'm pretty certain all of us have been on a course where they're like, this is how you market your business. You go in, you identify the problems and the pain points of your clients, maybe even the ones they don't know they have yet. And then you tell them how to fix it. So our entire cycle of marketing, whether it's around us or anything to do with providing a product or service is what am I fixing about that person? And what if we change that to nothing about

[00:57:16] you needs fixing, but here's how we elevate the quality of life for you so that you can exist as your best self. You know, it's literally down everything you buy instant rice. I'm literally just random thing. Instant rice exists because you don't have time. And I'm going to point out that you're really busy and you're failing at providing for your family. So here's a two minute option or insert anything here, but our entire marketing system is built around bringing people down so

[00:57:45] that you can get their money to build them back up. Yeah. You don't do any of the knocking down. You take, you take what you take the person that is there standing in front of you and you, you sort of hype them up, you know, and build them up. What I love about what you do is you're, you're saying you are actually brilliant and just right. You are enough. You are enough as you are.

[00:58:10] And I'm going to show you. And I watched it. I watched a clip that people can find on your, on your website of a lady who was interviewed after doing a shoot with you. And she'd almost done it as a sort of, I don't know. She, she'd gone into it kind of jokingly in a way. Um, something all her friends were doing. It was a boudoir shoot. So she's, she's wearing underwear. Um, and she's, um,

[00:58:37] I suppose maybe a little bit nervous. Um, but what you did was you showed her what she said, Tiggs showed me how she saw me and you doing that for her helped her see herself in a light that she, she, you know, ideally we'd all see ourselves in as other people see us. We see ourselves in such a negative, through a negative lens, but your lens of the, of your camera is a, is a, is a positive

[00:59:07] lens and it feeds people of positive reflection, um, or reality even. You already, you already exist that way. I mean, you know, I'd love to tell you my camera takes magical photos or I'm a Photoshop wizard. I mean, don't get me wrong. I am great at both. And she's very good. Yeah. But at the same time, you give me the raw materials, but I do think we, sometimes when we look at our own bodies

[00:59:32] and we're doing so in the privacy of our own home. And do you have the big light on? Because the big light is right above your head in the same way it is in a changing room. And you know, that really unflattering light where it like gives you like the shadows under your eyes. So you feel like you've got bags, it hits every lump and bump on the way down the body. So if you do have, you know, cellulite, anything along those lines or stretch marks or any kind of groove indentation, maybe you were wearing elastic that day and it's dug into your skin and left a mark.

[01:00:00] It's going to stand out more because the lighting is bad. Whereas if you put even, you know, if you feel that way in your own home and you took your mirror and say you've got a floor length mirror and you took it from that wall underneath your light in the bedroom, but you actually put it right next to your window where you've got full soft natural light in front of you, you're going to look and feel so much better about yourself because the quality of the light hitting your body is better. And it's little things like that, but we probably don't do that,

[01:00:28] right? Because windows mean out to the world and there's a possibility that someone's going to see us. So we keep the curtains closed and we don't stand by the windows when we're doing it. And it's that it's little things like that. But I think it's so important for us to see our bodies unedited, even if it is through photos taken by someone else and just accept that because at the end of the day, we're all beautiful. You don't look at your best friend and go, oh, by the way,

[01:00:53] you've got three more wrinkles than yesterday. I can see your gray hairs coming through. Oh, you know, maybe you've put on a couple of pounds since last time I saw you. You're like, I'm going to hype my bestie up. She looks amazing. They look fabulous. Oh my God, that outfit looks incredible on you. And it's just changing that narrative to be you are as iconic, hot, beautiful, whatever adjective you want to put in there. You are already those things. You just need someone to point that out to you in good lighting at great angles.

[01:01:22] Yes. So how did you get into this? How did it start for you? Did the burlesque come first? Did the photography come first? Oh, well, I'm actually, my degree is graphic design illustration. So design came first. I spent a lot of time watching America's Knockstop Model as a kid. I desperately wanted to be one of the photographers because I wanted to bring that to everybody, honestly, and give everyone the

[01:01:50] opportunity to stand in front of a camera like that and feel great about themselves. You know, problematic stuff aside, as a photographer, it was great. I used to sit and watch people play with really fancy cameras and teams and go to iconic sets. And I mean, who doesn't want to feel that fabulous in life? So I'd grown up watching that, went and did illustration, at some point picked up a camera. And I actually remember saying, I don't want to photograph people. I don't like working

[01:02:15] with people. I just want to do this on my own. And it turns out, I can't. Yeah. I needed photos of people to edit, make art with. And so people started posing. I would ask people to come in. A lot of my work colleagues from my part-time job in uni would come and pose for my camera and be in my projects. And word kind of got out, oh, this is actually really fun. We love doing this with you. You make

[01:02:42] us feel really comfortable. Other people started asking me, oh, I heard this. Would you like to, would you maybe photograph me? I'd like, I'd like that too. So I've been doing that for a little while, I guess, casually sort of through uni, graduated, handed out my CV. And there was a, I was, it was 2009. It was a recession. So I was handing my CV out to absolutely everyone. Where can this go? Who will

[01:03:08] take me? Get my 10 rejections a day, move on. And I'd sent it to a PR agency and they'd given me the, yeah, yeah, we'll keep you on file just in case anything comes up. And as it happened, their photographer had pulled out for the press event of a ballesque festival. Would you like to go? We're not going to pay you anything more than travel, but you can syndicate the photos and, you know, go from there. And it's like, well, yeah, I've got nothing to do. It's not going to

[01:03:33] cost me anything. I'll go see what happens. Walked into that room, finally found people that I felt like I truly belonged with, who made me feel so welcome. I felt included from the second I walked in the door. One of, I mean, she's now one of the most iconic international ballast performers in the world. That she was like, hey, like, come hang out with us. You look, you look lonely. Come, come over here. And yeah, I just literally found like I felt, found my people,

[01:03:59] talked my way back into coming back to the event. It ran, it was a Tuesday at the press night. It ran till the Sunday. So I, yeah, joined them, went for the whole week, made a lot of contacts in the burlesque world, gained a lot of clients. And that was like my first year in business sorted. And it kind of snowballed from there. People then were saying, I want to do this, but I'm not a performer. Can you photograph me? And the boudoir came along. And then people started saying,

[01:04:24] I love your boudoir work, but I'm not yet ready to take my clothes off. Could we do more like a personal branding shoot? Or can I bring like a glamorous sequin dress? So then the personal branding side came along and yeah, I would love to tell you that this was all a formulated plan, but I fell into this and people started telling me, I feel good. I feel safe in front of your camera. Can you, can we try this? And I'm, yeah, I'm along for the adventure. Let's go. Let's see what happens.

[01:04:51] It's fantastic. And you've, and you've had, and you've published a book as well from those experiences. Yeah. Yeah. So Striptease came out in 2019. It was published with working class publishing who are in America. And it is a documentation of my 10 years in the burlesque industry, traveling around the world, international performers. And it was important to me that as well as my photography, they got a voice in the book. So there's lots of stories in there about what

[01:05:19] burlesque means to them and how they feel on stage and why it's such an important art movement for them as well. So yeah, it's been a few years. Maybe it's time for another one. The, the, the transformation that you must see in the women when they come to you for a boudoir shoot or, you know, to, to, is it very visceral, you know, when they, when they arrive with you and when

[01:05:43] they leave, do you feel that, that change on set? Are they originally apprehensive or what's it like? I mean, it depends who the person is, but yeah, for the most part, you know, if it's your first time ever doing a shoot like that, it is so intimidating to contact a random stranger on the internet and say, Hey, I feel like I want to trust you to take photos of me in my underwear or, you know, whatever level of nudity they're comfortable with. So yeah, it's, it's, it's daunting

[01:06:12] to do the first time, but you only need the confidence to send the email and then we'll work on the rest together. So a lot of people can come in feeling very, very nervous. It is a, it is a very intimate thing to do for yourself. And it's just making sure that they know that they have full control and over the images where they're shared, nothing is ever shared without enthusiastic consent from them in writing. And even then they get to choose which photos,

[01:06:40] you know, which parts of them is their face in the shots? Are they tagged? Do they want to use a pseudonym? Whatever. So, you know, it's making sure they know that they have that full control. And actually this is a safe space for you to explore who you are, not how, not how your employer wants you to turn up and not how your partner expects you to be for them. It's how you want to show up in the world. The photos are purely for you and you have control over who gets to see them.

[01:07:06] And then just giving them that safe space to explore who they are, how they, how they feel and wearing clothes or outfits that they feel good in because the sexiest thing you can ever wear is confidence. Anything else on top of that, actually, it's just a plus. So yeah. And then just seeing that moment and when they see the photos for the first time, and I try and always make sure the photos are unedited so that they then have full control over how their body is honored in post.

[01:07:35] And it's, you know, some people want their scars left in their, their storylines to their bodies. Some people would like a little bit more done, you know, either way, but then it's, again, it's your full control. So while I might be wielding a camera at the end of the day, it's your vision and you have full control. Well, one phrase I wrote down from your TED talk, which I really love. And I think kind of, I should think about it every single day,

[01:08:01] I should write it on my wall is curate ourselves with intention. And I love that because I love the artistic sense of it. Um, and the, and the, the, the control, the self-control aspects of it, as in we have control, we have control of ourselves. We can, well, not everybody does, I suppose. I mean, but we have control over our thoughts and how we present ourselves to the world. Um, and that,

[01:08:29] and, and the intention and yes, feeling confident, you can put that, you can put it on, can't you? And sometimes if you put on confidence, that, that makes you feel confident. It gives you that little boost that you need to, to go out into the world. I think there are so many expectations and, you know, I can only speak from my own, but, you know, there are the expectations of being

[01:08:52] a daughter or a granddaughter. There are the expectations of being a client or, um, an employer, an employee. You also have the ones in your relationships, but you also have the ones in your friendships as well. And, you know, especially if you do relate to the term masking, maybe you have never really felt like you can show up as your full self. Maybe you have been told that you're too much. Maybe you have been told you're not enough. And so you're trying to fit

[01:09:21] yourself into all of these boxes for all of these different people to be all of the things. So maybe, you know, does your wardrobe wildly swing from, you know, the really fancy sequin glam that you actually love wearing versus the more monotone corporate, corporate girly, maybe that side of you as well. And it's being able to turn up and say, okay, well, actually, this is, this is who I am.

[01:09:50] Like if I had full control for a day, I want to show up. This is how I want my hair done. This is how I make my makeup done. I might not have those skills, but you know, you've got a professional hair and makeup artist, make me look like this person. I've always wanted to try X. I've always wanted to try Y. I would like to see how I look in this underwear. I, you know, I just want to wear really fancy heels for the day. Whatever that version of you is, it is a safe

[01:10:18] space to do it that doesn't affect your day to day, but it gives you a chance to go, what am I actually this person? Do I feel most confident this way? And try it out. It's almost, it, in whether that it might feel like a costume to you, but it might actually be unmasking. It could be either. And both are fine. Both are worth celebrating because, you know, the fantasy version of you and the most raw authentic version of you are both you. Yes. Yeah. And you also do coaching with people, don't you?

[01:10:49] Yes. So actually I, yeah, I do quite a bit of mentoring. I have one of my mentees this morning, so we just had a nice session and she's been nice to come back to that, to this off of that as well. But yeah, so a lot of mentoring for other creatives. Obviously, you know, if someone fits within the empowerment space and it feels like I would be of benefit to them in some way, absolutely.

[01:11:12] So yeah, it's just important. I feel that one of my mentors previously said, don't, don't pay it back, pay it forward. And I think that was an incredible piece of advice to have been given so early in my career. And I feel somewhat grateful that having learned, say Photoshop so earlier, mostly self-taught, but I was aware of what, what was going on in magazines so early on

[01:11:39] that a lot of the beauty standards just didn't rub off on me because it was like, well, I know what's going on in post-production. I know what is capable in these programs. So whatever I can pass on that I have picked up that I can, you know, make a difference. That's the important thing, right? Yeah. And the support and women, women supporting women, going back to where we, where we last saw TIGS in person was the International Women's Podcast Awards. And it was a room full of women.

[01:12:08] There's probably about five men in there. They've probably had a wonderful time. Handful of our lives. Literally handful. But it was just a wonderful, supportive environment. And any, you know, what you do to support women and empower women is so wonderful. Even, even for me, just looking at your website and looking at these beautiful pictures, they're always completely beautiful. And

[01:12:33] everything about the lighting, what the women are wearing, but they're also unique because they highlight the uniqueness of every single person you've taken a photo of. I just think it's so brilliant and it is inspiring in so many ways. And that's why I put my lipstick on and my, you know, my gold man-made fiber and my necklace because I was like, I want to, this

[01:12:58] is, I, I would love to, I quite like to wear a gold lame top every day, actually. You should. Why not? You look fabulous. Why don't you? I mean, you look great all the time. So, you know, I mean, you don't have to show up as anything other than yourself for me, but I mean, I will say 15 out of 10 today, no notes if you want to take this forward. But you also, you're sparkling over there. And I like that. I can see that you feel comfortable and you're happy and your eyes are sparkling.

[01:13:26] And, you know, if this, if a bit of gold lame in your daily life helps you show up and feel your best self, who says you can't? Yes. Yeah. This is it. This is exactly it. Oh, it's just so great. We're on the podcast called Limited Time Only. And we'd love to know. We have limited time only on the planet. Um, what else would you like to achieve, Tiggs? Or what would you like your legacy to be, I suppose?

[01:13:57] Oh, what do I want to achieve? Um, I mean, you've achieved a lot. So I mean, look, I'm a, I'm a, I'm a say yes to adventure person. I will say I've got a 40 before 40 challenge going for my 40th birthday in December. So there's a list of things on there that I guess are things I want to do. It's not an exhaustive list, but I was like, let's pick 40 things that seem like fun. So one of the things had been get my colour analysis done, which I did the other day.

[01:14:24] Turns out I suit gold more than silver. I'm still mourning that. I'm very much a silver person. Oh, um, are you, what season are you, Tiggs? What season are you? Oh, do you know what? Why don't you take a guess and I'll tell you if you're right, because I was wrong. Right. Well, you, you've got the same colouring as my daughter and she's very much an autumn, but I feel like you can probably take quite strong colours. So maybe let's go for a,

[01:14:51] oh, I don't fucking know. I don't know. I feel like autumn because you're the same colour as my colouring as my daughter, but maybe you're like a spring. I am in fact a true autumn. So I'm a warm tone, despite, I thought I was, uh, I thought I was going to be a soft summer. Um, but yeah, I'm a true autumn with a couple of extra, there's no pink in that palette, but I look great in bright

[01:15:20] pink. So we've added an extra pink in. Yeah. Oh, I should have just gone with autumn. That's the same as my daughter. You've got the same colouring. Well, I should have just asked you, you could have saved me some time. Yeah. Save me some cash. Um, so you've got these 40, 40 before 40 sounds, I'm going to have to go 50 before 50. Yeah. You know, I only got two years to do 50 before 50. It's so fun. Just, I put stuff on there. Like I want to, I want to see the sunrise. I'm not an early morning person. So it's like, let's do that. Let's go out. Let's make an active decision in my life

[01:15:49] to go out and see the sunrise. I mean, I have seen it rise a few times, but mostly because I've worked like into the night and it's not romantic in any way, you know, so things like that or, um, what else is on that list? Be a tourist in London. I've never been to Buckingham Palace. That's on the list. Apparently it doesn't open till July. So I'm having to wait. Um, rude. Yeah. Lots of,

[01:16:13] lots of different things. There was one, um, do something that scares you. Uh, I went on Tower of Terror at Disneyland Paris. I'm, I feel like I need to go slightly higher than Tower of Terror, but that's on there. Oh God. I hate anything that drops. Um, and then I had things like, uh, travel somewhere new. So I went to Laycock the other day. It was a spontaneous trip. Um,

[01:16:39] yeah. Laycock. It's a national trust village. A lot of TV shows are filmed there, but it's also Wizard Abbey. It's dubbed the home of photography, although controversial because apparently even they say in the exhibition, there were two timelines. Um, but it's also the cloisters in the Abbey there, you will recognize from a certain wizarding film. So if you were a big fan of a certain giant franchise,

[01:17:04] uh, that was filmed there, that's sort of the courtyard and like the hallways, corridors, corridors and professor Snape's classroom and all that vibe. So yeah, yeah, that was nice. I didn't know it was there. I just saw it on the way home and went, oh, you know, where is that? I know it's on our list of places to go. Um, uh, somewhere between Cheddar and me in Hertfordshire, but I'd say it's near like Cheddar Somerset way, like probably about 45 minutes an hour from then. That's so great.

[01:17:33] Um, in terms of, that's my achievement list. It's a, it's wild and varied, but mostly based around fun. Yeah. And then in terms of legacy, I guess I want my time on this planet to last longer than my time on this planet. I am child free by choice. Um, I don't have someone that's going to actively, you know, talk about me for the next three generations until I'm out of living memory. So

[01:17:59] I would like to make a difference. Yes, exactly. I mean, a blue pack would be great, but I think the idea is that I, um, I would like my photos and how I make people feel to last longer than my time on this planet. And so doing that through my photography hits that goal and, you know, just, I'd love to make a history book. I'm working on it. I'm not in one yet, but you know, that would be, that would be a nice thing.

[01:18:25] But I think the work that you do in empowering women is, is more than, is more than your photos and more than, more than how you make even them feel that your subject feel it's, it's, it, you are, that energy spreads out and yeah. And it, and you're bringing a really amazing, positive energy to the world. And I think that that's going to live on for a long, long time.

[01:18:53] Yeah. Well, I mean, even this conversation today, you shared with me that you've shared my Ted talk with your daughter. I, I have shown up in a way that has helped you go, I'm going to wear the gold lame. You've then had a conversation with your daughter that's gone. I want you to feel good about your body. And I want to make sure you grow up feeling good in your skin. That's already two generations. If your daughter, then she's 20, 30, if she chooses to have kids, or maybe she's a village

[01:19:20] to someone else's and she helps them feel better about their body in 20 years time, my legacy is working its way out. And that, that's what it means to me. I just want future generations to not have to go through feeling crap about their bodies. Yeah. That's brilliant. Thank you so much, Tiggs. You are absolutely brilliant. You speak so eloquently and so brilliantly. Yeah. You're fantastic. Um, and it was just so lovely to speak to you. I've got tears in my eyes again. That's obviously the

[01:19:48] effect you have on me in a good way. Thank you so much for coming on. Thanks for having me. Thanks for making time. And I appreciate this so much. You have been listening to limited time only. She is an absolute marvel. Isn't she? So, so open and talented and lovely. What a wonderful thing to

[01:20:17] set your life to do. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, she made me want to take my kit off and get her to photograph me. And that's, that hasn't happened for a long time. Yes, me too. And do check out all her stuff, everybody, because the, the, the photos on her website, Tiggs Rice, um, are brilliant and so lovely to look at. And you can see why women love being photograph, photographed, photographed by her. It was a thrill. Thank you, Tiggs. We really

[01:20:46] appreciate it. We could do a joint one, Suze. We could do a joint one. We could, we could film it for the podcast. No. No one wants to see it. They do want to see it. They do. No. Okay. Okay. You were very drawn French there. Oh, well, I will take that as a huge compliment. As it was meant to be. Yeah. Yeah. Because I love, I love Miss French with all my heart. Giving us all a boost. Um,

[01:21:10] so thank you. And thanks for listening. We will be back next week with a brief. And if you enjoyed this episode, please like it, subscribe it, share it with people. Please follow us on your podcast app. And if you haven't given us a review on, if you're on Apple, please click five stars. It's very easy. And a little review, it would just be brilliant. It would empower us and it would empower you. And it would empower you and you'd feel brilliant. Can I just say, if you are clicking five stars,

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